# Sticky  Farming Mealworms



## Reaper

Farming mealworms yourself has several advantages over buying them at a pet store. You always have mealies on hand so you don't need to spend time and money making trips to the pet store. You also control what the mealies eat thereby producing healthier mealies for your hedgie.
Here are some links on how to raise mealworms.
http://www.wormman.com/mealworm_breeding.cfm
http://www.nyworms.com/mealworms.htm
http://mealwormstore.com/raising_mealworms.php
http://www.sialis.org/raisingmealworms.htm


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## Katie

It would be great to give my little girl some fresh mealworms or beetles, but I'm to squeamish!!


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## LinzardB

the worse part about farming mealies is touching the Aliens.. they are CREEPY little things, i guess thats why they call them aliens.. they basically look like something from the movie ALIEN, and they dont move at all untill you touch them> if you touch them, or pick them up with tweezers, they TWITCH and its really gross..

otherwise, farming mealies isnt TOO bad. I used to farm mine, but i realized it actually was more work than it was worth.. ESPECIALLY with grubco and wormman selling worms at a really good price.


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## PixiesExoticHedgies

I just picked up a large container of mealworms, eggs, etc. from my breeder (she had plenty on hand). I'd been farming SuperWorms, but something went wrong and we lost the last of our colony. I also failed to take out the worms to "stress" them into beetle form. So I've decided to try mealworms. Not sure how different it is from the SuperWorms, so I need to read up on how to grow and maintain a colony of mealworms. I know the worms are vastly different.


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## LinzardB

mealies are actually VERY easy. Keep them in a warm dark place. and you will basically need two (or three) containers. Put your mealies in one container, and as they turn to aliens, you take them out and put them in their own container.. THEN you can have a third container for when the aliens turn to beetles.. Then, when you start to see the TINY little baby mealies, you can take all of the beetles out and put them in the container the mealworms USED to be in and just keep moving them around like that.. this way the beetles won't eat the aliens or the baby worms. 

Also, i used the little green jelly cubes to feed them. You can also put a slice of apple in the container.. you want SOME moisture, but not too much, because you dont NOT want mold. 

Otherwise, everything works on its own. The warmer they are, the faster they reproduce, but also, the more likely you are to get mold. 

We just kept ours in a drawer


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## LizardGirl

The pupae are disgusting, and they DO twitch! Euuchh. Geee-rosss. I'll leave em be til they're beetles, then Inky can snack on them. :lol:


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## LinzardB

You CAN feed the aliens too.. they are just really nasty to touch.. I did find that my gliders LOVED the aliens though.. they were extra gooey inside.


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## LizardGirl

I might feed them except I tell myself Inky will be afraid of them too! :lol: That would never happen. I'm just afraid to touch them... :roll:


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## PixiesExoticHedgies

*LinzardB *
Apparantly farming mealworms is identical to farming superworms. With the exception of the morphing process. Superworms must be isolated and "stressed" for them to morph. If they are kept in a colony, they stimulate each other and will not morph. Other than that, everything else seems to be the same. I usually feed them a mix of oatmeal flakes, grits, bran, etc. and sprinkle food with calcium to help gut feed them.


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## LinzardB

yea.. thats why i think they are easier.. you really CAN just leave them in one container and still end up with some decent mealies.. but three containers works the best.


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## Alicat42

I am pretty freaked out to touch the worms let alone any other of their stages..I use tweezers. I just started a small farm of mealies today!  
I used an old glass canning jar, filled it half way with bran (I only did half so its easier to get the wormies out for hedgie lunch, and when i get them from the pet store they're in a little tub with some bran already) and drilled SMALL holes, and keep it out of direct sunlight. *I like a lot of small air holes as oposed to less larger holes haha I'm not as worried that they'll escape then. I have yet to find a stationary warm place in my house haha I've been too busy watching the worms through the glass jar!! Its sort of like an ant farm...I never had one of those but it is really quite neat. I feed them by using a potatoe peeler on a carrot. I take one shred for the size of my jar and break it in little pieces with my fingers. Then its just a matter of dropping the little carrot bits in the jar and putting on the lid. And then watch! lol sounds icky but it really is pretty neat to watch them crawl up to eat...kinda creepy though, they really attack the carrot! Like little wormie wolves. And I do not put water in as its self. I've read that you can put drops of water in using an eye dropper, but they didnt take well to it at all. Then again my farm is only a ar or two big. My goal is to get the occasional beetle. 
This summer luna and I were in the garden, and she caught herself a black beetle. I know, thats not good, wild bugs are not necessarily safe what with pesticides etc, but have you ever tried to get a beetle out of a hedgies mouth? Not as easy as one would think.

I myself dont like superworms...they scare me :? . I went to ask about them, and the lady said not to get them if we have a long drive home as they will eat out of the bag, then the box, and then the store bag...And they bite. haha I know, I know, a lot of hedgies favorite bugs bite...but they're really big, and bite, I'm a chicken.

I was reading the first few posts, about feeding the farmed mealies to be more benifical/healthy treats for hedgies. What sort of foods would give the mealies more nutritional value? Like I said, I use carrots. 
Any suggestions, ideas, more info stuff like that?


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## Reaper

Adding a small amount of golden milled flaxseed to the mealie substrate is a good idea. However it is very oily and too much will cause the substrate to contain too much moisture. It is also VERY expensive compared to wheat and oat bran so a little goes a long way. I also add a few kibbles of Wellness Indoor Health formula dry cat food to my mealie beds. It is a good protein, vitamin, mineral source. I also place bird type cuttle bones in the mealie beds as a source of calcium. Hedgies don't require calcium the way reptiles do and too much can lead to kidney stones. I feed a good mix of high quality cat foods and that contains enough calcium for my hedgies. The mealies need the calcium to create their exoskeleton so I add a cuttle bone for just this reason. And if you do this you don't need to "gut load" the mealies calcium later unless you are also feeding reptiles.


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## Alicat42

Alright, I'll check in to the flaxseed! Thanks! I dont have the same brand of cat food but my hedgie is on another recomended brand, I'll put a couple kibbles in and see if they're gone tomorrow. They're really eat the cuttle bone? Thats interesting and icky bug scary :lol: I'm still getting used to the creepy crawlies, but luna loves em so eh I tough it out. 
Thanks!
Also, I was wondering if the alien pupae stage the go in to - do they do that in the bran, or do they come up to the surface to do the cocoon..metamorphose alien thing? I'm watching mine right now through the glass and they seem a little sluggish. Should I put them in a warmer spot, or have I fed them too much?


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## Alicat42

OK, so its been two days since they've become sluggish. I put a few of Lunas kibble bits in and they're still sitting there, as well as little pieces of carrots I put in there a day or so ago. They're not eating any more, and they're not even crawling around. I sifted through to make sure they didnt go to worm heaven. They're still alive, but arent worming their way around any more, when I did find some worms they moved almost lik they were in slow motion. 
I'm worried if the worms are sick, should I really still be giving them to luna?
And if they're not sick, whats going on? They aren't in their alien stage yet I know that.


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## Reaper

What is the room temperature ?


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## Alicat42

Its roughyl 20 -25 * celcius, and 45 -50 * faranheit. We have a wood burning stove in the basement, which is keeping a fire right now. Should I move them to the basement near the fire for more warmth?


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## Reaper

Yes they need to be around 72 F.


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## Alicat42

Wheph, Thanks!!  I was worried I'd have to start all over again.


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## r_k_chic47

Reaper, do you put whole kibbles in there or do you crush them up? I just started farming some mealworms a couple days ago too. I just put them in a tall coffee mug with rolled oats and 2 pieces of celery for moisture, then put plastic wrap over the top with holes punched in it. Not very professional, I know, but I only have around 50 mealworms so I don't think I need a great big container until I have a lot more. And by flaxseed, do you mean flaxseed oil? the kind that comes in capsules that you can put on hedgehog food? 
Alicat, I also use a tweezers to pick them up :lol:


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## Reaper

No it is milled golden flaxseed meal. Looks like wheat bran or oat bran. I find it at Kroger's in the organic section. Yes I put whole kibbles in there.


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## r_k_chic47

Ok thank you


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## Alicat42

Whoot!! So I checked in on my mealies, and changed some of the bran and I found my first Aliein pod!!! lol Out of the 53 that I counted, I had one deceased worm, one pod, and one white white worm. I figure it was close to going in to its little pod form but I put it back with the other worms because it was still in worm form. 
Was that the wrong thing to do? Should I have put it in with the pod? I didnt know, and didnt want to do it in case it ate the one in the cocoon. :?


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## LizardGirl

White mealies are mealies that recently shed. Basically means it is growing. You'll notice when they are about to turn into pupae, because they will have a darker, rougher look to them, and you might be able to see weird ridges on them. Until they turn into pupae, keep them in with the rest.


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## r_k_chic47

How can you tell if a mealworm is turning into a pupae, or dying? They turn dark when they're dead too


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## LizardGirl

Well, dead mealies turn black, and dead pupae are dark brown and hard. Live pupae are white and turn a beige-ish color, and live mealies are white or golden. Mealies just pupating will be a darker brown because they are about to shed a large piece of skin, and underneath is the white pupae.


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## Alicat42

Ooh okay, good! I have another question too. 
I changed the bran today because when I check on them, and feed them now they're mostly all on top! I thought at first they were on top because I needed to change their bran and clear out some worm doody. But they're all on top again! And food I put in there is used for drinking and then climbing on. There are maybe ...10 or so that aren't on top. 
They're all about an inch long now. So they've grown. But I dont think they've grown so much that I need to switch containers. 
But, could I be wrong? If not, whats going on??? What should I do?


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## LizardGirl

When they're on top, to my understanding, means they are happy and active. Mine usually do that when I bump up the heat.


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## Alicat42

Okay, thanks!! Thats a big reliefe.  I wonder if it could be because I put them closer to a humidifier (humidifyer?? what a strange word).


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## Alicat42

Okay, I have one pod in a seperate container. My worms are all on the top of the bran in their container still, but today they've really stopped moving, a lot. They seem sort of stiff like, and most of them are curled in a C shape, or nearly. They're not eating any more, and I'm assuming they're starting their metamorphies in to pod stage. I wanted to make sure though, that my assumption was right lol 90% of the worms are all along the edges of the container, and only a few half out of the bran in the middle.
Are things still moving along well?


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## Jeanette

Alicat42 said:


> Its roughyl 20 -25 * celsius, and 45 -50 * fahrenheit.


That's not quite right.

20°c = 68°f
25°c = 77°f

Here is a good website for celsius to fahrenheit and vice versa conversion.
http://www.wbuf.noaa.gov/tempfc.htm
Just type in a number in either celsius or fahrenheit and then click somewhere else on the page (not on a link though).


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## K9_girl1994

Do you think I could use yellow corn meal for the bedding?


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## Reaper

Yes but they do much better on wheat or oat bran.


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## K9_girl1994

yeah then we will try to get wheat or oat bran next time we go shopping


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## Lilysmommy

If you're keeping mealies in the fridge to keep them for longer, how often do you take them out to eat? I think I read once a week someplace, but I can't remember for sure.


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## M_Canadian

Where do you buy live mealworms? I have asked pretty much ever pet store and none of them sell them. Does anyone know where I could buy them in Vancouver BC ?


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## Immortalia

Hmmm, petsmart usually has them live.

Have you tried looking in yellowpages for a reptile store? That's what I did to find a place to buy them, and they were MUCH cheaper than pet stores. I just got lucky, that where I live, there's a huge reptile place(they've got like 5 anacondas and 1 crocodile O.O), amongst other various smaller reptiles. 

If you really can't find it, there are a few here who order them online by the hundreds. I'm sure someone here would have a link for you to take a look at.


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## M_Canadian

The Petsmarts out here done sell any live food, no crickets nothing. I cant find any Reptile stores I don't think thats a big market out here. I emaild a guy off Craigslist that calls himself the Reptile Guy to see if her knows where I can get them. 

If anyone on here buys or sells them and could give me a price that would be great too.


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## Aleshea

http://www.exoticnutrition.com/LIVE-INSECT.htm

you can order them online here.


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## Zalea

Lilysmommy said:


> If you're keeping mealies in the fridge to keep them for longer, how often do you take them out to eat? I think I read once a week someplace, but I can't remember for sure.


For 24-48 hours every 1-2 weeks usually works.



M_Canadian said:


> The Petsmarts out here done sell any live food, no crickets nothing. I cant find any Reptile stores I don't think thats a big market out here. I emaild a guy off Craigslist that calls himself the Reptile Guy to see if her knows where I can get them.
> 
> If anyone on here buys or sells them and could give me a price that would be great too.


They might carry canned ones at the Petsmart, like most places do for canned crickets. They're not live, of course, but they're about the same and are still moist unlike freeze-dried ones. You might check there in the reptile section if you don't want to order online.
You might also check at some smaller pet stores if you have any around. It wouldn't necessarily have to be a reptile store specifically.


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## Lilysmommy

Alright, thanks Zalea.


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## basmati

I'm in Alberta, and the store I get my mealworms from is PJ's Pets (drove by it today, and had to remember the name :roll: ). I don't know if that store is in BC, it is a chain here. Good luck. Started my first farm based on a tub (100 for $4), one pupae so far.... This thread helped out with it. Thanks.


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## Lilysmommy

Where do you guys buy your wheat/oat bran? I have my mealies in oatmeal right now, would that be okay for them to live on, or should I switch?


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## Reaper

You can find oat bran in the cereal section of any grocery. I buy wheat bran in the organic section of Kroger. I also use corn meal and a little bit of milled golden flax seed meal.


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## DumplingHedgie

Oh that seems simple. I migh try that, thanks.


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## Lilysmommy

Okay, sorry to bring this up again, but those of you that have bought the wheat or oat bran, what is the name of the box you get? I tried going to the grocery store right near me today, and was searching the cereal section, but the only thing I found that was anything close to either was wheat bran flakes, and I didn't think that was right...Or am I wrong? I've only checked the one store so far. I could go to Kroger's tomorrow, though.


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## Reaper

The oat bran is close to the oatmeal. It is Kroger's brand oat bran. Another brand is Hodgson Mill Oat bran all natural hot cereal. The wheat bran and milled golden flax seed meal is in the organic section and is in plastic bags. It is Bob's Red Mill brand.


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## Lilysmommy

Awesome, thanks!!  Off on another hedgie-based shopping trip tomorrow, then, lol.


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## Reaper

I have also seen Hodgson's Multi grain or such and it has a bunch of bran's together including flax and soy. I may try that as well.


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## Lilysmommy

I just found my first aliens! I have two formed, and another that's halfway between worm and alien. And I dunno what you guys are talking about, I think they're cool! :lol:


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## SnufflePuff

I have a bag of organic porridge oats, which contains oatmeal, oat bran, wheat bran and flax seed. Would this work if I crushed it up? I originally bought it as a fiber source for my hedgie but no one knew if the whole flax seeds were safe so I bought her baby rice cereal and grapenuts instead. But now I don't know what to do with this bag cause I don't really like oatmeal so if I could use it for my mealworms that would be great!! 

Also is it alright to use pet store mealworms as your starter colony?


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## Reaper

Yes it is fine. And yes you can use pet store mealies as a starter colony.


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## SnufflePuff

Reaper said:


> Yes it is fine. And yes you can use pet store mealies as a starter colony.


Thanks Reaper.


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## SnufflePuff

How many mealworms did everyone start with for their starter colony? I've read anywhere from 50-1000 and I was just wondering how many I would need to start. I currently have one hedgehog but might be getting another one in the next six months so I want to have enough mealie output to satisfy two hedgies. 

Thanks!!


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## basmati

I started with a tub and a half, ~150 mealworms for one hedgie and so far so good. I am amazed at how easy it is. I now have my first generation of mealies, and some older beetles in another container. The mealworms are all in various stages in length (some at the almost eating size again). During the experiment, I would still feed from the farm all stages: larvae, pupae, and beetles. I usually feed 2 per day. Of those who escaped hedgie teeth, I had the occasional loss of small larvae, all pupae made it to the beetle form, but I did have some beetles that were eaten by others. I read somewhere that 20 beetles is a good number to have to ensure eggs are laid, as 40 eggs can be laid per day. This is only one generation, so who knows if this is a norm.

In addition, when things were slow, and in order to have another generation, I substituted crickets. Depending on temperature and how many raids you take and if your hedgie finds the farm :lol: , I'd eyeball it. You can always add another tub to increase your numbers when you get your next hedgie and see if he/she likes mealworms. Good luck!

Note: I did one test, putting out a mealworm, pupa, beetle, and cooked chicken to see what was considered a favourite, and the first thing that was gobbled up was the chicken. Go figure :roll: .


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## Hedgehog madness x

*Ive been thinking of doing this.. the videos are helpfull so thank you o yes what is the healthiest thing to feed the meal worms... do you know? im stuck on thta one *


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## Reaper

I mix wheat bran, oat bran, and just a little flax seed meal. Sometimes I add a little corm meal as well. I also add a few kibbles of Wellness Indoor health.


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## Hedgehog madness x

*I want to breed them... what is the Alien???
And what better for them super worms or meal worms? and what do they like better.. i hate worms so not sure if i want to breed them but mmm not sure*


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## Lilysmommy

Alien is the pupae form of the worm, between the larvae stage and the beetle stage. Mealworms are safer for them because superworms are pretty aggressive. If feeding them, you need to cut the head off before feeding them or they can bite the hedgehog while it's eating/swallowing them.
You don't neccessarily have to breed them for one hog, either. If you just buy one or two hundred, they'll last you awhile.


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## Hedgehog madness x

*Ok so first what ones should you feed the hedgehog.. meal worms , beetles WHAT as ive never farmed them before and am thinking of doing it.
HELP plz lol*


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## Shelbys Mom

I just started my farm today so I can't speak from experience.
But I believe you can feed any of them (mealworms, pupae, or beetles) to the hedgie.

OT...(sorta)
I know this is a hedgie forum but since this is about Mealworms..
Does anyone know if Tarantula's can eat these beetles?
I know she can eat the mealworms she loves those.


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## SnufflePuff

Shelbys Mom said:


> I just started my farm today so I can't speak from experience.
> But I believe you can feed any of them (mealworms, pupae, or beetles) to the hedgie.
> 
> OT...(sorta)
> I know this is a hedgie forum but since this is about Mealworms..
> Does anyone know if Tarantula's can eat these beetles?
> I know she can eat the mealworms she loves those.


Yepp you can feed all 3 stages from what I've read. I don't see why a Tarantula couldn't eat the beetles if she already eats the mealworms, they would essentially be the same thing. Maybe search it up on the internet just to make sure though.


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## Shelbys Mom

Ok thanks I'll do a little research see what I come up with.


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## SnufflePuff

How long before the aliens turn into beetles?

I find my mealies are turning into aliens really quickly, but I've only gotten two beetles out of the aliens so far and it's been a few weeks. And how do you know when the aliens are dead? A couple of mine have gone dark brown and some black but I don't want to remove them in case they're actually turning into beetles.

Also what moisture sources does everyone use? I'm using carrots right now, but I find they're molding within a day and making my bedding all moldy and gross so I keep having to throw it out. Anything less moldy I can use?

Thanks


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## basmati

I think the time it takes the alien to change to the beetle depends on temperature/humidity, but for myself, I find it takes a week. I use carrots, but I do not put in whole carrots, just junks. I tried peelings at first, as another was doing this (from this thread), but I found they dried out too quickly. It is really dry here, so depending on where you live, you may want to try out some peels as see how it goes. I did try potatoes, but I didn't like the smell of them as they dried out. Celery dried out too fast as well. Trial and error, and what your nose can stand.

I never had a dead alien, but I would think if they have turned black, like the larvae, they are dead. Are you moving the aliens over to a second container? I read somewhere that some people feel moving them is too hard on them, as they are fragile. I use a spoon, so I don't squish them, and have not had that experience. If the aliens are not being moved over to another container, they may be munched on by the mealworms. Good luck.


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## SnufflePuff

basmati said:


> I think the time it takes the alien to change to the beetle depends on temperature/humidity, but for myself, I find it takes a week. I use carrots, but I do not put in whole carrots, just junks. I tried peelings at first, as another was doing this (from this thread), but I found they dried out too quickly. It is really dry here, so depending on where you live, you may want to try out some peels as see how it goes. I did try potatoes, but I didn't like the smell of them as they dried out. Celery dried out too fast as well. Trial and error, and what your nose can stand.
> 
> I never had a dead alien, but I would think if they have turned black, like the larvae, they are dead. Are you moving the aliens over to a second container? I read somewhere that some people feel moving them is too hard on them, as they are fragile. I use a spoon, so I don't squish them, and have not had that experience. If the aliens are not being moved over to another container, they may be munched on by the mealworms. Good luck.


I think I must be stressing the aliens because I am gently picking them up with my fingers, but maybe I will try a spoon! They're going in a separate container and so far only 4 have hatched. 2 of those beetles are still living (in a 3rd containet) and the other two were deformed and died. I think I'll try carrot peels, because I find my containers are too moist and go moldy.

Thanks!!


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## basmati

SmufflePuff, your welcome.
Hopefully the two beetles you have are male and female! If the aliens that hatch are poorly formed beetles, I'd hand these over to your hedgie to do the deed. They probably wouldn't live long enough to lay eggs and it gives your hedgie a chance to try them out, and a chance to catch them. If you search a 'demented beetle thread, this had that info'.
As well, I don't put lids on my containers, which seems to help against any mold build up. 

I cannot remember where I read this, but I thought I read something about "if major mold, you have to throw the entire container away and start new"-- can someone help with this advice if it is true, or I dreamed it up? For some reason, I thought that some type of bug (mite?) grows in that type of environment. Please take this last bit with a grain of salt until a more experienced farmer can help with this.


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## SnufflePuff

basmati said:


> SmufflePuff, your welcome.
> Hopefully the two beetles you have are male and female! If the aliens that hatch are poorly formed beetles, I'd hand these over to your hedgie to do the deed. They probably wouldn't live long enough to lay eggs and it gives your hedgie a chance to try them out, and a chance to catch them. If you search a 'demented beetle thread, this had that info'.
> As well, I don't put lids on my containers, which seems to help against any mold build up.
> 
> I cannot remember where I read this, but I thought I read something about "if major mold, you have to throw the entire container away and start new"-- can someone help with this advice if it is true, or I dreamed it up? For some reason, I thought that some type of bug (mite?) grows in that type of environment. Please take this last bit with a grain of salt until a more experienced farmer can help with this.


I hope they are too lol but they probably aren't :roll: I will definitely try feeding my hedgie some deformed beetles thanks for the advice, I've just been letting them die. 
I'm leaving the lids off my container now too, and so far no mold yay! I'm also using carrot peelings which dry up in about a day but I'd rather change dried out carrots than moldy ones.

Yes I believe they are called grain mites (?) and they grow when it's too humid and make your bedding smell like pine. The "major" mold was really only in the beetle's container, and slightly in the alien's container but the mealies container was safe and didn't really smell like pine I don't think. Either way I picked out all my mealies, aliens and beetles by hand and put them in temporary containers. Dumped all my bedding and scrubbed the containers, put in new better bedding (mix of organic oat bran, wheat bran, a little cornmeal and a tiny bit of golden flax) and carefully wiped the mealies clean of any old bedding dust before putting them back in the new bedding. If ALL THAT didn't work and my bedding starts smelling like pine cause I still have grain mites well then I will gladly go buy some new mealies and start all over. :lol:


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## Shelbys Mom

How long do the beetles usually live?
How long should I leave them to lay their egg's before I start feeding them to the Hedgie's and spider? :? 

And another stupid question...
What kind of beetles are they? What are they called? :roll:


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## Reaper

The "Darkling Beetle". They get darker as they get older. If you are trying to start a mealie farm let the beetles live a couple of weeks or more. After you get some eggs hatched and you have several stages of mealies at the same time it isn't that crucial.
Here is a good link to raising a mealie farm.
http://www.sialis.org/raisingmealworms.htm


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## Shelbys Mom

Thank you Reaper!!


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## SnufflePuff

Reaper said:


> The "Darkling Beetle". They get darker as they get older. If you are trying to start a mealie farm let the beetles live a couple of weeks or more. After you get some eggs hatched and you have several stages of mealies at the same time it isn't that crucial.
> Here is a good link to raising a mealie farm.
> http://www.sialis.org/raisingmealworms.htm


How long should the beetles be left before you should start changing their bedding (so they dont eat the eggs/baby mealies) and how often should you change their bedding?

Mine have been alive a few weeks and ive been changing the bedding every 3 days or so now but no mealies so far so im not sure if im changing it too soon/too often.

Thanks! :mrgreen:


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## mommyofmany

Not sure if it's any help, but here's another link you can add to your list: http://justforfuzzies.com/Other_Stuff/o ... worms.html

I wrote the tutorial and based the info off of multiple sites I'd read(including some on your list). So, it's got the best of each site all in one place. 

SnufflePuff, if the beetles are "new", then you should wait about a month before switching them to a new bin because they don't start laying eggs til they're about 1-2 weeks old. After that, you can switching them every 2-3 weeks.

Give them new bedding each time you put them into a new bin and leave the old bedding in the original bin because that's got all the babies and eggs in it.


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## Shelbys Mom

I'm just wondering what is the most nutritional to feed the mealworms and beetles?
I mean most nutritional for the Hedgies (and other pet's) when they eat them?

I'm currently feeding mine baby carrots (potato's went bad to fast) 
Is there something else that I should give them in addition to the carrots or in stead of?

I know there's several things that can be fed to the mealies but I don't know if any will make them more nutritious for them.


----------



## Reaper

They eat the bedding. So I mix wheat, oat, flax seed, corn, and soy meal. Majority being wheat and oat bran. I also add a cuttle bone for calcium and out of date high quality cat food for the vitamins. Carrots for moisture and I have more mealies than my girls will eat.


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## mommyofmany

Reaper, are you using hold or ground flax seed? If ground, then you should stop using it because ground flax seed will spoil at room temp within a week. Whole seeds are good for about 4 months at room temp though.

Also, corn is nutritionally lacking and is known for having high levels of aflatoxins, which, I know, are dangerous to sugar gliders, so I assume the same would apply to hedgies.

Personally, I use a base of wheat bran and mix in brewer's yeast and powdered milk. The milk adds nutrition and the yeast adds nutrition and also makes the mealies grow faster.  I've also heard that spirolina(sp?) is a great additive, but I think it's pretty pricey.

I buy all my ingredients from www.bulkfoods.com .

Little tip: if you feed Kiwi it will make the mealies grow bigger and faster!  However, be sure to take any leftovers out after 24 hours so it doesn't spoil.


----------



## Shelbys Mom

Ok Thanks Reaper 
I have mine in a mixture of Oat Bran and Multi Grain. I've put a little bit of the cat food. And they seem to like the carrots.
So I think I'm just missing the cuttle bone. I'll pick one of those up.
I'll see about picking up some powdered milk as well. Thanks mommyofmany!

Mine seem to be growing great. 
All 4 of my Hedgie's the tarantula and the scorpion have all been eating them and I'm going to have to move them to a larger container because there running out of room :?


----------



## MonoTekETeA

Make sure you keep an eye out for Grain Mites. My brother used to buy super worms for his Chinese Water Dragon, and I remember a while ago being skeeved out about all these little bugs crawling around in the tank. Well after reading up on growing my own worms and how dangerous mites are to hedgehogs, I did a search for chinese water dragon and grain mites, and what do you know, it can be a problem. This probably led to the death of Fido a few weeks ago when I was told that I had to take care of him while the family was gone, and I come home to a dead lizard.  He also had a infection in the mouth that we were treating, and my brother had just left for the army, so maybe those three factors combined just did the deed...

So yeah, watch for Mites. When I start my farm, I am going to have hawk eyes for them...ugh, I hate them.

Edit: Doh, I forgot the original reason I read this thread. So is gutfeeding them where you plump them up before feeding them to your hedgies? And if so, is there a way to add oodles of nutrients to the worm, so it is like giving the Hedgehog a multivitamin of sorts, because you fed the worms so well?

-Jeremy


----------



## Reaper

I freeze all bran and such for a day or so before I add it to the mealie farm. I have also been told carrots only will keep the moisture content down which helps deter grain mites. I used to give apples and potatoes for moisture and had an out break of grain mites. The owner of Grubco told me to just use carrots as this is what they did to reduce the chance of grain mites.


----------



## SnufflePuff

Hey,

I was just wondering, would that cricket gel water stuff be safe to use as a water source for the mealies? I read it on one of the mealie "how-to" links posted on here, and was just wanting to double check. I find that even with a single carrot or half a carrot that with the lid on my containers, I get too much moisture and with the lids off it dries up within less than half a day.

I know that's what petsmart uses to hydrate their crickets and I feed those to my hedgies and have never had any health issues because of it, so I assume it would be safe? I would just use the regular non-calcium kind for the beetles, and then maybe the calcium kind for the mealies for their exo-skeleton. I also have cuttle bone too so maybe that's too much calcium.

Any thoughts?


----------



## sillybowtie

After a 2+ months of no mealworms for Ace but taking care of 6 beetles I have now 200+ mealworms. They are so cute so small and Ace's belly was happy last night.

I do not use any carrots or potatoes for water but just use a quarter size amount of paper towel and wet it every day. I put several pieces in the cage. The beetles could drink the water from it. Now I am putting a plastic bottle cap filled with wet paper towel, (I was out of clean sponges). This is what I would do for the crickets. 

I had to put them in a bigger cage than the small container that they came out of at petsmart so now they are in a baby wipe container.


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## Nancy

What do you feed them? Not only do carrots and potatoes provide water, they also provide nutrition that ultimately goes to the hedgehog. Potatoes do need to be removed daily. Adding a cuttle bone will add calcium and the mealies love to tunnel in it.


----------



## 123Hedgiesloveme

can you give them reptile calcium?


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## LizardGirl

You could sprinkle some in the bedding but it likely won't make a huge difference.


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## ap0226

I'm gonna attempt to start a small mealworm colony. I have about 40 worms, I threw them in a bucket (the kind that butter comes in) with whatever bedding they came in. I'm guessing wheat bran? I added some baby oatmeal cereal mix & malt-o-meal. I put a baby carrot & a peeled grape in there too. Is this stuff okay for starts?


----------



## SnufflePuff

ap0226 said:


> I'm gonna attempt to start a small mealworm colony. I have about 40 worms, I threw them in a bucket (the kind that butter comes in) with whatever bedding they came in. I'm guessing wheat bran? I added some baby oatmeal cereal mix & malt-o-meal. I put a baby carrot & a peeled grape in there too. Is this stuff okay for starts?


I would remove the grape. Since grapes are toxic to hedgehogs you don't want the mealworms eating them either since the hedgehogs will eat the mealworms and end up with the grape toxins inside of them.

Otherwise sounds okay to me, not sure what malt o meal is though or if that's okay to use. I use a mix of oat bran, what bran, corn meal and flax seed. Cuttlebone ( buy in the bird section of pet stores ) is a good thing to add. You can also add pieces of the cat food you are feeding. You will eventually need 2 other containers too.


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## ap0226

COol. Thanks for the info about the grapes! But will the grape eventually flush out of their system or should I throw this batch away? I'm kinda worried now. I think Malt-O-Meal is kinda like Cream Of Wheat, not sure though.


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## Lilysmommy

Just don't feed them to the hedgehog in the next couple days and they should be fine. Food goes through their systems quickly because of their size and structure.


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## ap0226

Okay, thanks I plan on getting all the stuff mentioned on here for bedding but is the bedding I'm using now okay? Malt-O-Meal should be okay right?


----------



## nikki

I looked up Malt-o-Meal and as long as you're using the original flavour of hot cereal it should be fine.


----------



## ap0226

Thanks


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## Faifai

Er in case anyone in the Vancouver region is having trouble finding places to buy mealworms, PJ's Pets in Richmond (near Aberdeen Station) sells them. They're by the reptile section. Pet Habitat in Metrotown Centre (Burnaby) sells them too but you need to put yourself on a list that needs to fill up before they will make an order with suppliers.

**also** I thought I recall reading somewhere that it's okay to put crushed eggshells in with the bedding for some extra calcium... Will the mealworms be ok with that? I would like to verify before I just throw the eggshells i've collected (from hard-boiled eggs) into my tubs.


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## Shelobe

Ugh, so I found a couple pupae in with my mealworms and I went to pick them up to move them to another container. They starting wriggling around! Ugh, thats nasty. They are all white and I read the darker they become, the closer to beetle form they are, I also read they do not move but these things clearly move around when I touch them. Is that right, because it's disturbing.


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## PJM

:lol: Yeah, they sort of twitch when you touch them. GROSS! I found a beatle in our mealworm container the other day & had to wake a hedgie up just to eat it. The only think my husband has ever been adamant about in our 19 years of marriage is there will be NO beatles allowed in the house. :lol: You understand that I am trusting you all with this info - hedgie-daddy would freak out!!


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## Shelobe

Haha, I think I'd take a beetle any day over these alien pods. I can't wait until ****tles gets to try his first beetle, I think he is going to like it.


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## CoxMD

Do the adult beetles fly? I'd love to farm some mealies now that Basil is used to getting them, but I don't want beetles all over my house either. (Of course they'd be in a container but you know what I mean.)


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## LarryT

CoxMD said:


> Do the adult beetles fly? I'd love to farm some mealies now that Basil is used to getting them, but I don't want beetles all over my house either. (Of course they'd be in a container but you know what I mean.)


They don't fly.


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## CoxMD

Great! Thanks Larry for the fast reply!

Are carrots a good thing to gut load with?


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## LarryT

CoxMD said:


> Great! Thanks Larry for the fast reply!
> 
> Are carrots a good thing to gut load with?


Yes. I use carrots and sweet potato.


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## albino_prickler

I have to agree "farming" mealies is very easy... i have 6 cat litter pans going now that has been up for almost 2 years now and they are still going... I had one month where i was short due to hatching out so many leopard geckos and bearded dragons that they wiped out majority of my colonies... But now with my sugar glider and flying squirrels they are going very nicely... when i get too many they make great fishing bait and blue jay food... I know this might sound gross but I have been known to snack on a few myself... they are very nutritional for animals and humans... besides if anyone ever drinks Tequila and eats the worm, you know that the worms are meal worms... Sry just had to put that in for an FYI... lol...


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## PJM

Ewww! :lol: TMI Albino!!! :lol: :lol:


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## MissC

albino_prickler said:


> when i get too many they make great fishing bait and blue jay food... I know this might sound gross but I have been known to snack on a few myself... they are very nutritional for animals and humans...


 :shock: :shock: :shock:

OH.....MY.....GOD.

I told my BF when he first bought maggots for his Oscars that if he's going to rely on me to do feedings, his fish are going to starve.


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## Brayrox

is it alright to feed your hedgie superworms? i've been giving them to her for about a month or 2 . Please Help!


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## PJM

Superworms are OK - but you should cut off their heads first. They have been known to continue to bite even after being eaten, and at least 1 hedgie has died from internal injuries. And just make sure also not to give them too many at one time.


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## Brayrox

PJM said:


> Superworms are OK - but you should cut off their heads first. They have been known to continue to bite even after being eaten, and at least 1 hedgie has died from internal injuries. And just make sure also not to give them too many at one time.


ok thx


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## PJM

I have baby mealies!! They are so itty bitty. They're almost cute! :? Woohoo!


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## MissC

PJM said:


> I have baby mealies!! They are so itty bitty. They're almost cute! :? Woohoo!


"almost cute"...almost... 

We've been trying to raise them and have finally got past the "Good Freaking Lord! What the bloody **** is THAT???!!!" alien pupae stage and have moved into the "OMG!!! These beetle things are going to move faster and sound worse when eaten!!!" stage.

I can't wait to see what happens next... :roll:


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## megan4032

Do the hedgie's eat the beetles too? I am a new owner and had no idea about this beatle pupa thing :shock: I knew it would turn into something but if you don't feed the mealies will they still turn into beatles and how long does it take???


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## LizardGirl

Yep, hedgies will eat the beetles too. They're much crunchier and lower in fat. 

If you aren't feeding the mealies, it will take a fair amount of time for them to pupate, and then it's a few days after that, that they shed into beetles. But hedgies will eat all stages.


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## megan4032

LizardGirl said:


> Yep, hedgies will eat the beetles too. They're much crunchier and lower in fat.
> 
> If you aren't feeding the mealies, it will take a fair amount of time for them to pupate, and then it's a few days after that, that they shed into beetles. But hedgies will eat all stages.


Ewww :? but thanks


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## MissC

If you're grossed out by mealies, the beetles will be even worse (to me, anyway). :roll:

They're much faster and all those little legs and antennae wiggling around??? eeeeeewwww

But the worst is the audible crunching sound they make when they're being eaten. :shock: Snarf loves them and it's a hoot watching him catch them cuz he's gotta be quick!!! But...the crunch....<shiver>


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## Marilyn

I've tried to give Bailey a couple small meal worms and she doesn't even sniff them, she just walks right past them as if they aren't even there. I tried to hold it in front of her nose to see if i could interest her but ...nothing! I put one in her food dish and she ignored it all day and I ended up leaving it there over night and it seems to be gone now. I'm not positive she ate it though...lol


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## iinustii

Ooo, we're growing mealworms too! So much cheaper than always buying them - the petstore prices are ridiculous and with webstore orders the shipping costs way too much to do it regularly so we came to the conclusion it's better to just grow our own...

I actually just updated our blog with an entry about our farms and how we do it (HERE)


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## morgan

A few questions...
How do you clean out the frass without cleaning out some of the tiny worms with it? And how exactly do you sift out the frass from worms & bedding from the beetles, do you just dump them in a sifter, or is that too hard on them? :roll: 
Do you just dump all the beetles' bedding in with the worms, or would that accumulate too much bedding (if there is such a thing?)

And is 1000 worms too much for a colony? I can get 1k for $20 right now, so it seems like the price is right... I only have one hedgie, but I also want to try offering some to my cichlids...


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## morgan

bump?


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## emilyinwaiting4

can you feed both the meal worms and the Beatle?


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## ShutUpAndSmile

Yup  My girl likes the beetles. She likes to chase them haha.


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## emilyinwaiting4

That would be so cute!! I was afraid that they only ate the meal worms and I was going to end up throwing the beetles away


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## TennHedgehogs

I have started out with 25 superworms separated 12 , this is the second day being in a closet , I took them out today and two of them are dead and 2 have shed their skins. the 2 that shed their skins are they still growing?


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## ShutUpAndSmile

Careful with super worms you HAVE to cut their heads off before feeding. They have been known to bite on the way down biting the poor hedges neck. 
If they're shedding thats a good sign, means they are growing.


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## TennHedgehogs

Thanks for the Heads up so to speak lol 

I don't want them to grow i am trying to stress them out , to turn them and they just keep shedding their skins , they have been in a dark place for a week now , with no substrate , another week maybe?

I did buy reg meal worms see what happens with them , I just leave them in the container to have them turn?


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## TennHedgehogs

I got my first superworm alian so to speak , weird looking


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## TennHedgehogs

Images are to high in pxls so here are the links
Super Beetle
http://i40.tinypic.com/kccyf.jpg

Super Aliens
http://i40.tinypic.com/xm0h7q.jpg

Meal worm aliens
http://i39.tinypic.com/b93qu.jpg


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## Rainy

TennHedgehogs said:


> Super Aliens
> http://i40.tinypic.com/xm0h7q.jpg


 I love how your superworm aliens live in an apartment building.


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## TennHedgehogs

I have magic jumping beans? made a screen bin for my Beatles and looked on the bottom of the container and its millions of jumping mealworms or at least I hope they are mealworms :shock:


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## jerseymike1126

Rainy said:


> TennHedgehogs said:
> 
> 
> 
> Super Aliens
> http://i40.tinypic.com/xm0h7q.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> I love how your superworm aliens live in an apartment building.
Click to expand...

You have to do that. The larvae will not turn to pupia unles they are isolated. I tried to breed them but my beetles would die off and not breed. My guess is the humidity was way to low, my basement gets real dry in the winter


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## elithranielle

I read that dark beetles infest rice. Does this mean rice can be used as bedding for mealies?


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## Maddie The Hedgehog

I'm starting my own mealie farm. I'm so glad that these links and info are here. I should have checked out reapers links on the very first post before reading all 13 pages of these comments xD haha but oh well. I'm assuming that beetles eat the same stuff as mealies? And do the aliens need to eat and drink water too? Probably a silly question but oh well^^ I put my mealies in oats like you would use to make oatmeal with. I also put an apple slice in but I'm gonna change it the next day and start changing the food every day so it prevents mold and mold mites( I hope that idea works and prevents them?) The lid of the container of mealies do have air holes in them as well  and what do you do if colony of meal worms get infected with mold mites? Do you throw the meal worms away and start over so I would have to buy more from the pet store?


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## Lilysmommy

Beetles get the same thing as mealies, yup. Same bedding and carrots/potatoes/whatever for moisture. Aliens do not need anything to eat or drink, they're just pupae, kind of like caterpillars in cocoons. I usually kept them in their own small container with a little bedding at the bottom anyway, and a piece of paper towel over them in case a beetle came out on its back, it'd have something to grab on to. For moisture, I always used carrots for both the mealies and beetles. They were moist enough to work well, but they weren't so moist as to go moldy quickly like apples probably would. I could put in a carrot and leave it for a couple days before throwing it out and adding a new one. Usually, the beetles could finish their carrots before I had to put in new ones. I'm not completely sure on mites, as I never had that happen, but I would imagine you'd have to start over in order to get completely rid of them.


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## Maddie The Hedgehog

Ah ha ok thank you  I guess I would think to prevent mites you would have to be pretty good of the upkeep on the worms and changing the food often. I don't have carrots right now so I put like maybe small chunks of apple in there and I put it in there during the day and let them fill up their bellies til night then I dispose the apple and put a fresh piece in the morning. This seems pretty easy. I think I'm starting to get the hang of it. Can I mix the oatmeal with uncooked rice? Or can they eat that??


----------



## mrjeffrivera

I just bought some mealworms yesterday but Johnny (my hedgehog) totally doesn't seem to be interested in them at all so I don't know what to do. I've just been giving him the Science Diet cat food instead. I guess I should throw them out if he doesn't eat them by tomorrow. I don't know what they turn into if you let them live long. I don't want anymore bugs in my house. I do live in Costa Rica afterall.


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## Maddie The Hedgehog

Dont throw the meal worms away! i had that same problem with maddie. she wasn't interested at first but a good way to get them interested is too cut the meal worm in half and then put it up to its mouth and then they will want it. i know it sounds gross but with the smaller mealies, its not all that bad.


----------



## cardiologineer

I was curious if it would be ok to feed the dead beetles? At this point, I've run out of mealworms (I've got some of the tiny ones but it'll be a while before they're big enough to feed), which isn't that big of a deal because I'd probably rather feed her more beetles than mealies anyway (I'll probably pick up some new ones soon but I don't feel in any hurry since I wasn't feeding them to her that often anyway). But I'm always worried when I do feed her a beetle that it will be a female who was about to lay eggs (I have probably 40-50 right now and a ton of aliens, some of which are very close to becoming beetles). It's probably not that big of a deal because there's plenty of others, but I'd feel better not taking away any potential new baby mealies. 
I could see how maybe the dead ones wouldn't be as nutritious or perhaps would have stopped eating shortly before death and wouldn't have the fruits/veggies I feed in their systems anymore. But I figured I'd ask. The other option would be feeding males, but I looked it up and they're super hard to tell apart. The other day I noticed one pair that was mating so once they were done, I fed Zannah the male. :lol: But normally, it would be too hard to tell. Anyway, I figured it'd be worth asking about the dead ones, just in case! If I can't feed them to the hedgie, will the other beetles eat the dead ones or should they just be thrown away? I figure some of mine will probably start dying before too long because I started getting some beetles a few months ago.


----------



## moxieberry

I wouldn't feed dead ones, unless you know they literally just died. They start to decay as soon as they die, and feeding decaying matter of any type isn't a good idea.


----------



## cardiologineer

moxieberry said:


> I wouldn't feed dead ones, unless you know they literally just died. They start to decay as soon as they die, and feeding decaying matter of any type isn't a good idea.


That makes sense. Thanks.


----------



## SpiritWolves1

My worms keep turning black then dying, all the small ones! And the only alien I found so far turned black and died. I have 3 chunks of apple in there and oatmeal and some catfood too, but idk what else to do, any advice?


----------



## moxieberry

The apple may have gotten the bedding a little damp, which can create mold and kill off a colony. Change out the bedding completely and move any living ones into there. I always press pieces of apple, baby carrots, and chunks of potato lightly in a paper towel to get rid of the extra moisture before putting them in. Also, I only use Granny Smith apples, which is the only kind I eat anyway, but instead of getting mushy and nasty after a few hours or a day, it just kind of shrivels and dries up, so it doesn't get the bedding all nasty. Always take the pieces of apple, etc, out the next day, even if there's some left.


----------



## jngy slate

can someone please help me. so i put an inch of wheat bran or oatmeal in, and then put some veggies in there? i would like to put cricket food in there, its got vitamins in it. im not sure how much to put in though. im getting the cricket food idea from this page

http://www.fishpondinfo.com/worm.htm


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## Lilysmommy

That's about it. Make sure you change the veggies out regularly & don't put too many in. If the bedding gets too damp, you'll end up with mold/mites. You don't have to use cricket food unless you already have it & want to get rid of it. You can just put some of your hedgie's kibble in.


----------



## jngy slate

well i am trying to kind of maybe eliminate some kibble if i can. i read about powdered cellulose being in chicken soup for the cat lovers soul lite and now i dont want to feed it. other cat foods have other stuff in them too. i was going to fill up the mealworsm, put the water cube in there that has calcium on it, and maybe give a reduced version of cat food, with like 6 mealworms a day or something.


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## Lilysmommy

There's still plenty of quality cat foods out there. It's just easier to toss some of the kibble in than to get another separate food...but it's up to you. Just double check the ingredients of the cricket food too - I'm sure some of them are just as bad as lower quality cat food.

I'm not sure what you mean by water cube - is that going in the mealworm container or with the hedgehog? Mealworms don't need much moisture (they'll get the water they need from veggies in addition to the nutrition) and it's more likely that you're going to make them too damp with a water cube.

You'll have to wait & see for mealworm amounts. Different hedgehogs have different tolerances for how many mealworms they can digest - you'll want to watch for constipation, as well as weight gain.


----------



## jngy slate

my plan is to feed the meal worms spinach, carrots, kale, and jurassidiet (which has alfalfa, krill meal, fish oil, fish meal, spirulina, beta carotene, Vitamin A Acetate, D-Activated Animal-Sterol (D3), Vitamin B12 supplement, Riboflavin, Niacin, Folic Acid, Calcium Pantothenate, Pyridoxine hydrochloride, Thiamine, Biotin, DL Alphatocopherol (E), L-ascorbyl-2-polyphosphate (C), choline chloride, cobalt sulfate, copper sulfate, ferrous sulfate, manganese sulfate, ethylenediamine dihydroiodide, mineral water) and feed less kibble.


----------



## jngy slate

the problem im having in my head with the kibble is hedgehogs dont eat meat, they are insectivores? can they turn meat into proper energy? and can they turn carbs like peas into energy


----------



## Lilysmommy

Hedgehogs aren't insectivores, they're omnivores - they're classified wrong. You can't just replace kibble with mealworms. Mealworms are fatty insects, and if a hedgehog eats a lot all at once, they're at risk for constipation from trying to digest all of the exoskeletons at once. Either way 6 mealworms is still around the "treat" stage, for the most part, not a "replace kibble" stage. And like I said, you'll have to wait and see how the amount works for your hedgehog - tolerance levels for the extra fat & fiber vary.

If you want to give your hedgehog a more natural diet to lower the amount of kibble fed, you need to do a lot more research on hedgehog nutrition and how to feed a balanced, varied diet. I suggest starting with the nutrition stickies at the top of this forum section, then you'll likely need to do more research on which veggies are more nutritious and so on. I would definitely continue feeding kibble in addition to giving him or her fresh/cooked meats, veggies, etc. Feeding a homemade diet only requires doing a lot of research & knowing that you have all of the necessary vitamins and nutrients covered. It's not as easy as just giving them a lot of insects.


----------



## jngy slate

i need the amounts of vitamins to put in it. it says omnivores eat plants and animals. does this mean he can process peas? can i get a slug or a worm and give it to my hedgie?

i was thinking of putting the things that are in the cat food, in the mealworm feed dish. so he would get to eat the mealworms and some fat, but wouldnt have to eat peas or powdered celluse


----------



## Lilysmommy

http://www.hedgehogcentral.com/foru...3034-beginner-s-guide-hedgehog-nutrition.html
http://www.hedgehogcentral.com/forums/12-diet-nutrition/23058-offering-fresh-foods-treats.html
http://www.hedgehogcentral.com/forums/12-diet-nutrition/23066-raw-home-cooked-diets.html
http://www.hedgehogcentral.com/forums/12-diet-nutrition/26025-guide-insects.html
http://www.hedgehogcentral.com/forums/12-diet-nutrition/17725-treat-list-safe-fruits-veggies.html
http://www.westcoasthedgehogs.com/files/hedgehogbook/download.html Nutrition section


----------



## jngy slate

it says in the book hedgehogs eat carbs. what carbs? carbs from plants? or peas? if they eat carbs, then why would people need to feed them a raw diet?


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## Lilysmommy

Okay, really, you need to actually read things. It says in the book that carbs are veggies, fruits, and grains, so yes, plants. Peas are veggies, so peas are carbs. Peas are also rather sugary as far as veggies go, so they're not nutritious as other veggies - that's why I recommended doing more research into the nutrition of different veggies.

I don't really understand your last question. A raw diet for hedgehogs includes raw meat as well as raw veggies, fruit, etc. They don't need to be fed a raw diet, and actually that's probably the most difficult of the diet options since you need to consider the risks of bacteria growth on raw meat, especially in a heated hedgehog cage.

Honestly, I'd really recommend you stick with feeding kibble, and keep insects, veggies, etc. as treats and supplements. Doing a homemade diet takes a TON of research and reading - you would need to read all of the links I provided and then do a lot more research & reading afterwards, as well as preferably discussing vitamins & minerals with a vet. The people on the forum that are trying homemade cooked or raw diets already have experience with that kind of feeding with other pets they have, or they are doing hours and hours of research so they understand what they're doing. To be perfectly honest, you don't seem to be able to do that. If the homemade diet isn't properly balanced & includes all of the necessary nutrients, your hedgehog will suffer from it - and dietary deficiencies can take a long time to show up, and be difficult to reverse once they've started. That's why we only have a few people that are trying this method of feeding - others don't feel they're up to the task of doing all of that research & preparation, especially with the risk of missing something and hurting their hedgehog.


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## jngy slate

im gonna feed the kibble but id like to start a homemade diet, a basic one. and build on it. and eventually feed it to her. or give her some of the diet and some kibble. but grains seem like they would be bad for a hedgehog, like what grains do they eat. i guess i will read about it. when i read that dog food cat food page, it said dogs and cats should never have grains.


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## Lilysmommy

Keep in mind you're better off not planning out some kind of big homemade diet now. You're going to need to start slow - make sure the kibble diet is settled first with what you want (introducing one food at a time over at least 2 weeks), then start introducing other food treats. You only want to give one new food at a time - and it may take numerous attempts to get them to try something. So there's not much point in planning out that you want to feed them x, y, and z foods three times a week if they end up not liking those foods.

Cats shouldn't have grains, or anything else - they're obligate carnivores, they would eat only meat in the wild. Domestic cats often have a taste for weird foods though, so there's only so much an owner can do - I know someone who feeds a raw diet to their cats, but the cats continuously try to steal bread products. :lol:

Dogs are omnivores, like hedgehogs. They can have some grains - rice is usually a common part of homemade diet recipes, though I can't recall if any others are used or recommended. With hedgehogs, I think most people stick with veggies for the carbs.


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## Ron_0305

hi guys does anyone know where i can find a breeder of mealworm here at leduc or edmonton canada?? like to start my own colony... thanks in advance


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## Katten

Just go to Petsmart, they're like 5 bucks for 100 worms. :B


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## purrsngrrs

Mealworms are actually very good for Hamsters but you should also check the other dietary needs of Hamsters which they should be given.
http://purrsngrrs.com/hamster-food-dietary-needs/


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## hedgehoginthetardis

any tips for keeping these things alive?

I've bought so many from petco and get them home and only half of them are alive. I throw them all into some oatmeal with some apples and then put them in the fridge have no luck at all....

tips?


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## Lilysmommy

If you keep in the fridge constantly, they're going to die. You need to take them out at least once a week so they can warm up & eat if you want them to live longer. When you have them out to warm up & eat, you can put a piece of carrot or apple in for them to eat & for moisture, but take it out before you put them back in the fridge - it'll rot & get moldy otherwise, and that will kill them as well.

As for when you first get them from the pet store, open the container while you're still there & take a look through. If 1/4 to 1/2 of them are already black & dead, ask the employee for a different container. You could also ask to accompany them to the fridge to look yourself, so you can choose a container with the best looking mealworms.

If your pet store seems to have awful worms, I would suggest checking online. There are websites that sell mealworms (and other feeder insects) & you may have better luck with them.


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## magicpaws788

farming mealworms is not bad but it's not so easy as we think.


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## Katten

Okay so... I decided to experiment with raising mealworms and superworms together in the same container. The only information I could find online stated that it couldn't be done, but it didn't say why and I needed to see for myself. 

It doesn't work. The larva don't bother each other despite the size difference, but the mealworm adults will team up and kill the superworm adults... which sucks because it was hard work breeding these things.  I would have preferred it the other way around, but now we know.


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## tony21

Never thought of doing that, but that's kinda odd. I stopped breeding supper worms , after I got mites 2 times. Plus I have other feeders in the works that are much better, come spring I will have a few more to add to my collection:grin::roll

I still breed mealies, but I use wheat bran (no mites, nor dust from using oats).


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## Katten

Well, now I'm a bit frustrated. 

I went to the pet store and bought some new mealworms and superworms. The mealworms were very small so I figured they were just young, but now they've started to turn into pupae and beetles and they're still tiny! They're about half the size as the beetles from my previous attempt. Is it just because they were malnourished from being kept in peat at the pet store, or are they a different breed? Am I going to end up with tiny worms in the next generation? :S 

I've fed off most of my supers, but I "made" some adults too... Four have hatched today and they all have some degree of wing/shell deformity, and one of them seemed all sorts of messed up and walked with a limp. They were also kept in peat at the pet store. I'm feeding them off while they're still soft. Some of them

My previous mealies and supers were kept in oatmeal at the store. Are these new wormies just malnourished? :c


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## marissa.peterson

I have TONS of beetles, but I can't see any baby mealies. Tricks?


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## Kalandra

Beetles will eat their own eggs and young larvae. Quite often you have to remove them from the container in order to get a new colony established.


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## marissa.peterson

How long should I leave the beetles in to lay eggs before moving them to the next container? How long until the eggs 'hatch'?


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## GothicBreena

*What is it? (Freaking Out!!)*

So I decided I was going to breed Mealworms so I don't have to go to the pet store as often seeing as I just got two two and a half month old baby sisters, plus I already had my year old Stella and my year and a half old Knuckles. My mom has her own Shes 4 years old and her name is Maleka, so we go through a LOT of mealies in his house. So the breeding went well but then I had both my hip replaced so I decided to just feed my hedgies the mealies and beetles. I noticed in the empty container we kept the meal worms were in there was the oatmeal, and a few pieces of cardboard from flattened toilet paper tubes but in half and on top was a few big larva/pupae so I tossed them into the container that I used for the beetles and they hatched. So just Now I just grabbed both totes, found a few more larva/pupae but there's not a SINGLE meal worm in it so I tossed them in the beetle container then I noticed the lid was dusted with what looked like dust but if you looked closely they moved, then there was a section in the corner of the tote that was layered but with a more thicker layer. I made sure the area I was doing all this transferring and stuff in has been cleaned and I disinfected my hands and temporarily put the container on the patio until i know what they are. Thank goodness there is not any holes in the lid of that container.

Can someone help me PLEASE?! I'M BEGGING.


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## hedgelady1414

*Dont buy at Petsmart*



Katten said:


> Just go to Petsmart, they're like 5 bucks for 100 worms. :B


The mealworms at petsmart will cost you a fortune plus I have bought from them in the past and the mealworms seem to be treated with a hormone that ciases them not to pupate. They just grow larger and larger until they die.

Buy online at places like :

Fluckers Farms
Gold Country Mealworms
Rainbow Mealworms

Save you money and they are not treated with the hormone.


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## Draenog

This thread is from 2008 and hasn't been active for months. I don't think it's going to help your company any if you keep posting your website over and over again in old threads -- it's just annoying probably.


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