# Picky baby won't try new food



## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

Herbie is 6 weeks old as of today and I have been trying to feed him some treats. He eats his Purina kitten food just fine, but he won't try anything new. I tried strawberries with no response at all and even a hedgie favorite, mealworms. He sniffed and licked the mealworm, but wouldnt eat it. I even broke one in half(got guts all over me ew!) And rubbed it gently on his nose. He licked his nose and seemed to like it, but I still couldn't get him to eat the worm. I set a few in with his normal food, but I don't think he's eating them. Any suggestions on getting him to try something new?


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## MomLady (Aug 14, 2010)

At this point, everything is new. Just make sure he's getting settled and eating for the next couple of weeks, then try the mealworms again. Remember to try one new food at a time, to avoid tummy upsets. 

It sometimes takes a few tries before they will eat something new. And then sometimes they will quit eating something they used to like. 

They are spikey toddlers. :grin:


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

Thanks. I will just keep trying. You are right about the little brats being like human kids haha!


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## Ally's_Oliver (Feb 8, 2015)

My hedgehog wouldn't eat anything but his normal food at first either. I think they are just trying to hold on what's comfortable to them. Give him a little time, he might come around and begin eating a huge variety like mine did. My friends hedgehog, who is much older than mine, however, never became interested in any other foods. Every hedgehog is different.


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

Well let's hope he's not going to be picky:lol: I want him to have a healthy diet and a variety of things he likes.


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## sc2001 (Oct 12, 2014)

It took my hedgie 4 months to try new foods. I consistently offered until she finally tried something. Now her two favorite treats are mealworms and ground turkey.


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

Cool I might try the turkey. Thanks for your help.


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

In my opinion, it'd be a good idea to focus on letting him get used to his new home right now, and then before you continue trying new treats, switch him to a better quality food. Most Purina foods are pretty awful and it'd be more beneficial to get him on a healthy main food right now than to get him eating lots of other treats. Here are a couple of stickies that explain more about what to look for & what brands are good to look at - http://www.hedgehogcentral.com/foru...3034-beginner-s-guide-hedgehog-nutrition.html and http://www.hedgehogcentral.com/forums/12-diet-nutrition/23042-recommended-foods-list.html

As MomLady said, only one new food at a time - so if you start introducing a new food to replace Purina, that means no other new treats during that time. Make sure you switch over slowly, over 2-4 weeks. If you decide to mix together two or more foods, introduce each food separately.


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

I checked the bag label and the ingredients seem fine. He seems to really like it too... I don't really want to risk him refusing to eat if I change the food. Its specialized for kittens and a book my mom bought for hedgie care stated what I should look for in the food.


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

Which food is it, if I can ask? Purina does have some okay lines, but most aren't good. To be honest, most hedgehog care books are pretty out of date and many have incorrect and even harmful information in them, which is why I'm asking. I just want to make sure you haven't gotten incorrect advice from the book, just in case. 

It's also a good idea to do a mix of two or more foods for the reason that you're nervous about - some hedgies are so picky that it can cause a food strike if you run out of the food they're used to & have to suddenly change for some reason (recall, food shortage, etc.). If you have two foods that your hedgie is used to, even if one becomes unavailable, at least you still have one that they'll eat. So even if you stick with the one you have, I would still really recommend mixing in a second good quality food.


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

Well the breeder gave us some of the food she used which is Nutrient Rich Hedgehog Diet Ultra Blend Select. He won't eat it now that we gave him Purina One Smart Blend Kitten Formula. He loves the stuff.


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

And we do mix the food, but he nust picks out the "good" stuff.


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

The hedgehog food isn't a good food either, so it's fine he won't eat it. I would just get rid of it. It's not one of the outright harmful hedgehog foods, but not a great food either.

To be honest, there are quite a few bad or at least poor-quality ingredients in the Smartblend food. If you want, I can go through & explain more fully which ingredients aren't good & why. Obviously the choice is up to you, but IMO, it'd be better to switch. If you'd rather not, it'd still be a good idea to find a different food to add to it, since he's not eating the hedgehog food anyway. You want two foods that he actually eats!  If you do look for a second food, look for one with 30% protein or below - the kitten food you're feeding is a bit too high in protein at 40%. You want the protein to be around 35%. If you get a second one with 30% or below, then together they'll even it out to 35% or below.

Edit: I don't mean to be unfriendly or discouraging or anything, so I hope that's not how I'm coming off.  I just want to be helpful! The Purina food isn't the worst food ever, and it's not likely to kill your hedgie or anything. It's just really common for people to not know the details of all of the ingredients & how they can be bad, so I like to offer to help with that in case people are interested in learning more.


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

Please feel free to tell me about the food I'm giving him. I want him to be healthy and happy. If you could, could you please list some not so overpriced foods I can give him instead?

EDIT: You are perfectly fine. You are being very helpful and friendly in my eyes.


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

Oh and the book I ave is Hedgehogs by Barron's


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

Forewarning, this will be a long post! :lol: Here's the ingredient list for the food:



> Chicken, chicken by-product meal, *corn gluten meal*, *brewers rice*, *soybean meal*, *animal fat preserved with mixed-tocopherols (form of Vitamin E)*, *fish meal (source of DHA)*, *whole grain corn*, *poultry by-product meal*, *animal liver flavor*, phosphoric acid, *soy protein isolate*, *caramel color*, salt, choline chloride, calcium carbonate, potassium chloride, Vitamin E supplement, taurine, zinc sulfate, DL-Methionine, ferrous sulfate, manganese sulfate, niacin, copper sulfate, Vitamin A supplement, calcium pantothenate, thiamine mononitrate, riboflavin supplement, Vitamin B-12 supplement, pyridoxine hydrochloride, folic acid, Vitamin D-3 supplement, calcium iodate, biotin, *menadione sodium bisulfite complex (source of Vitamin K activity)*, sodium selenite.


I bolded the ingredients that are iffy or that I have an issue with.

Corn gluten meal is a filler & a cheap way to boost the protein content of the food. Corn isn't very nutritious for most animals, and shouldn't be included in dog & cat foods. Hedgehogs don't really need it either, and excess carbs in food (like corn & other grains) can contribute to weight gain.

Brewer's rice is pretty much the same - a cheap filler with little to no nutrients. Rice in a food isn't a bad thing (and it's a better grain choice than corn or wheat), but it should be whole grain rice. Brewer's rice is a byproduct from another industry, not whole rice.

Soybean meal is another cheap filler, and also a source of protein, but not a great one for carnivores or (for the most part) omnivores. I also have a major issue with soy being used in pet products because it's a huge GMO product in the USA. Some people don't have a problem with that, some people do. I have a problem with it mainly because most GMO products come from Monsanto, a truly awful company, and long story short, a lot of their actions are harming both people and wildlife (especially bees & butterflies).

Animal fat is an issue because it's too nonspecific. If the ingredient isn't specifically named (chicken fat, turkey fat, etc.), the guidelines allow for it to come from 4D animals - dead, dying, diseased, or disabled animals. While that could just mean a cow that broke its leg before it made it into the slaughterhouse, it can also include some pretty awful things that you wouldn't want your hedgie eating.

Fish meal is also too nonspecific. You have no clue what kind or quality of fish was used - it could be iffy ones that couldn't be used for human consumption, it could be cheap bait fish that aren't nutritious, it could be fish that are high in mercury or other toxins. All fish not meant for human consumption also has to be preserved with ethoxyquin, a toxic preservative.

Whole grain corn - another cheap filler that doesn't have a lot of nutrition for non-herbivorous animals.

Poultry by-product meal - again, too nonspecific. Could come from 4D animals. By-product meal is also iffy because it includes parts of the animal besides the meat. While that can be good, necessary things like internal organs, that can also include parts with very little nutrition - head, necks, feet/legs, intestines, etc. Those things would have their place in a balanced raw diet, but when they're a major source of protein in a pet food, that's not very good. I thought about bolding chicken by-product meal because of that, but at least with that ingredient, it's definitely from chickens, not from 4D animals. The quality of the ingredient would still be questionable though.

Animal liver flavor - also too nonspecific, you don't know what kind of animal that's coming from.

Soy protein isolate - same problem as the aforementioned soybean meal. It's also just another cheap way to boost the protein content of the food with a source that carnivores can't digest. Protein should primarily come from animal-based ingredients, not plant.

Caramel color - Sugar! Not something that should be added or necessary in a good food.

Most of the other ingredients after that are just vitamins & minerals added to the food to try & balance it. However, the last bolded ingredient is an issue because it's a cheap option for that vitamin, and it's also dangerous. There's more information about it here - http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?page=menadione

The site I linked there is my favorite source for information on all of this stuff, but my training I received when I worked at a petstore backed most of the basic stuff up, which is one reason why I consider them a good source. There's more information on all of these ingredients here - http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?page=badingredients

Some good brands available at Petco include Canidae (grain-free), Halo, Merrick, Natural Balance, Solid Gold, and Wellness. Petsmart has Innova, Simply Nourish, and Wellness. Nulo has good ingredients, but the protein is a bit too high for their cat foods - they would be okay mixed with a lower protein food. You can also check dog foods at both stores (same brands, including Nature's Variety at both stores) since dog food tends to have lower protein. The small breed foods are typically around the same size as cat food, but you still may have to break the pieces up to make it easier for your hedgie to eat. But they're another option, if you're interested!

All of these foods are probably going to be a few dollars more for a bag than Purina One. But keep in mind you're getting a better quality food - in my opinion, they're not overpriced. I would call foods like Hills Science Diet and Royal Canin overpriced, considering they have a pretty high price tag, but they're both only medium quality foods.

Also keep in mind that two 4-5lb bags of good quality foods will probably last your hedgehog at least 3-4 months.  You won't be spending that much at all per month on food for these little guys, so it's usually worth it to spend a few dollars more for a good food.

(Hope the length of this post isn't too intimidating! I like discussing nutrition and pet foods. :lol: I also hope it ends up being helpful. )


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## MomLady (Aug 14, 2010)

Please don't call your hedgehog a brat.

They are just doing what hedgehogs do, we have to adapt to them.


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

I'm calling him a brat playfully. Im not saying it to be mean.


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## Ally's_Oliver (Feb 8, 2015)

i don't want to overwhelm you with information, but my hedgehog was on hedgehog food (one of the worst ones, too) when I got him. i immediately wanted to switch him but held off for a few weeks until it seemed like he was getting settled in. once i decided to change him over i read tons of articles, books, talked to people on here, looked at recommended foods list, you name it and then consolidated all that information into an outline that i created myself and carried it to the store with me. I chose a day when i had time and spent about an hour in the holistic cat food section of the pet store debating and reading ingredient lists until i could walk out with 3 foods i felt great about. Since switching Oliver over to a high quality diet he's maintained a healthy weight, been happier, and gets full from a smaller portion of food which means he poops less over all. If interested i can provide you with my "Oliver's kitty mix" recipe along with my "food selection guide" that I took to the store with me or you can create your own. i promise you though, no one on this site will give you bad advice. Many of the members who frequently respond to posts really know what they are talking about and I don't know where I would be without them.


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

Thanks for the offer, but I think I have enough information to find the right food. Not trying to sound rude or anything.


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

Ok problem. My mother is refusing to listen to me and saying very rude things. She won't listen to me about our current food being bad for him and she's yelling and throwing stuff. Will the food we have now hurt him? She says I shouldn't be listening to some random person on the internet because they all give false advice and that the breeder knows what she's doing, which she obviously doesn't if she feeds that food to her hedgies...


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

Well, that's not very nice at all. :? I'm sorry! If she's going to be that awful about it, then it sounds like it'd be best to stick with what you have for now. No, it shouldn't hurt him, and it's definitely not the worst food out there! Perhaps you could wait until this bag is starting to get low, then maybe bring up the idea of trying another food again since you'll have to get more food anyway? Make sure you have enough of the old food to do a change over 2 weeks still, if you do give that a try. If she really won't listen to reason, then don't push her too far.

I don't know if this would help, but you could also check out this hedgehog care book & show it to her - http://westcoasthedgehogs.com/files/hedgehogbook/index.html If she puts a lot of stock in a breeder or vet's opinion, I'm sure she'd be happy that that care book is written by a breeder with years of experience in hedgehog care, who is also studying animal care, etc. in college. She's also doing research on hedgehog diets & a better food for hedgehogs. Maybe that would interest your mom?

Good luck, and I hope your mom doesn't stay upset at you!


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

Thanks. She just had a bad day and I guess it upset her because she already spend a lot on our current food.


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

Sounds like bringing it up at a later time would be a good idea then. 

Also, and I want to make it clear I'm not meaning to insinuate anything or offend, but are you 100% sure that she will be willing to pay or help pay for vet costs for your hedgehog when needed, not dependent on whether a lot of money has been spent recently, etc.? I know that's a different matter than food, and don't want to assume that she wouldn't. But I ask because it's been a major problem for other younger hedgehog owners on this forum before, who depend on their parents to pay for vet costs. Sometimes those people have also had trouble convincing their parent that the hedgehog was sick or that it really was an emergency that needed a vet ASAP. When a hedgehog needs a vet, it usually means in the next day or two, not in a week or so. And in many cases, you can't just wait & see (which a lot of parents seem to want to do) since that can give the illness time to get much worse & much harder (and more expensive) to fix.

So I just wanted to check & make sure both you and your mom understand that hedgehogs need a yearly wellness exam, and that vet costs can sometimes be up to or over $500 if something is wrong. Sometimes things like pet insurance can help, but it's just something to be aware of. $9 for a bag of food is a very small amount compared to vet bills for a sick hedgehog. 

Again, I'm not meaning this offensively or assuming anything - I just want to check since it's a common problem I've seen on here.


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## Flamepool (Apr 11, 2015)

I understand your concern. Yes she would take Herbie to the vet if needed.


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