# Pet store vs breeder



## aydree (Oct 19, 2012)

Does it really make a difference personality wise? I figured it would depend on the age?


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## cardiologineer (Sep 29, 2012)

Generally hedgies from a breeder are going to be much more socialized. It certainly isn't a 100% correlation and personality will vary a lot no matter where you get them from, but your chances of getting a more sociable hedgehog would be much better from a breeder. 
Not to mention the ones from breeders are much more likely to be way healthier which I'm sure helps them be happier and friendlier.


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## moxieberry (Nov 30, 2011)

If you buy a hedgehog from a pet store, you can (and likely will) get any combination of:
- sick (URIs in particular, also mites; various other things from poor care and diet)
- unsocialized
- probably pregnant (if female)
- no health or WHS guarantee
- no return policy
- no post-sale support
- poor suggestions/information for care
- considerably higher chance of genetic problems, including WHS; also a good chance of inbreeding

A hedgehog from a good breeder:
- well socialized
- has pedigree; not inbred; from good lines
- pre and post sale support
- health guarantee and lifetime WHS warranty
- return policy
- good sources of information, recommendations for good supplies, etc
- will come with a starter bag of food
- option to buy hedgehog-appropriate supplies in addition to the baby

And, after all that, pet store hedgehogs are pretty much always more expensive.

So, yes, it does make a huge difference. In terms of personality, and everything else.


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## ponylover317 (Nov 20, 2012)

It makes a HUGE diffrence. Pet stores risk disease, in-breeding, no guarentee against WHS, mites, females could be preggie, most are listed as younger than they are, they are un-socialized, etc, etc, ETC.
I got layla from a breeder for only 165$, which is cheaper than even some petstores! I have a 6 year pedigree of her, i met her mother and father, she was very well socialized, she is GUARENTEED against wobbly hedgehog syndrom, the breeder gave me a contract, care booklet, sample of the food she was on, and the names and #s of many hedgehog-working vets in the area. Layla had already been to vets as a younger baby, and had no problems * For hedgehogs, and really ANY animal, do NOT go the petstore route!!!!!*


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## pickles17 (Feb 18, 2012)

A breeder's baby will be be much more friendly. 

One thing that I love about my girl that I got from a breeder in comparison from the two I rescued was that I can touch her face without her immediately huffing, most times I can pet he back or pick her up without her huffing and rolling into a ball. This is because my breeder spent time getting her used to being held and touched at a young age so she's comfortable with it. Obviously not EVERY breeder hedgehog will be this way, but anytime I had held a hedgehog at a pet store it almost always curled into a tight ball and refused to come out, or it had a gooey nose (URI) etc.

Just get it from a breeder, you'll be happy you did.


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## shmurciakova (Sep 7, 2008)

I agree that buying from a breeder is better, however, pet store hedgies are not all bad. Both of mine came from a pet store. The first time I didn't really know about hedgehog breeders, and this time I had seen Daisy at a pet store back in May. I went in again in August and she was still there. I just felt sorry for her and I ended up getting her. I know that if you buy a hedgehog from a pet store they are just going to obtain more and that perhaps it encourages them because they know they can eventually sell them, but I think that pet store hedgies deserve a loving home too!
For example, if you live very far from a good breeder, where a hog would have to be shipped, etc. then a pet store might be the way to go. I am not trying to argue that a hedgehog from a breeder is probably better, I am just saying not all pet store hedgies are ill tempered or impossible to socialize. Clearly, the older they are, the more difficult it might be to bring them around to being friendly.
-Susan H.


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## AngelaH (Jul 24, 2012)

I got my hedgehog from a pet store and she has been very healthy and super sweet and mellow. 
However, now that I've heard the arguments against pet stores, I feel that I would encourage people to go through good, reputable breeders whenever possible to discourage pet stores from selling hedgehogs. I just feel so bad for those hedgies living in pet-store-conditions


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## moxieberry (Nov 30, 2011)

A hedgehog from a pet store can definitely be a good pet - but if you have the option, you should purchase from a breeder and not a pet store. It doesn't mean the hedgehogs are "bad" (although you certainly may have issues as a result of it not being properly socialized in the store) - it's about pet stores, and the sources that pet stores get their hedgehogs (and other animals) from.

If someone purchases from a pet store, they have a much higher chance of getting an unhealthy hedgehog. If you're lucky, there won't be immediate health issues, although I've seen plenty of people having to pay vet expenses within the first few weeks - with pet store hedgehogs, and also pet store puppies, etc. In the long run, it's not going to be as healthy either. Hedgehogs from breeders tend to have longer, healthier lives, because breeders have health and longevity in mind. Pet store hedgehogs tend to not live as long and have more health issues earlier in life - it can be from a combination of poor care in the store, possibly being weaned too early, not starting out with a proper diet, and being from bloodlines that are bred indiscriminately (with no regard for whether the animals are "breeding quality") and often inbred.

Take puppies, for instance. More and more these days, people are well informed and know that pet store puppies come from "puppy mill" type sources. It's the same for hedgehogs, and every other animal. They come from "mills" (aka wholesalers).

For the same reason I have always told people not to buy puppies from pet stores, I strongly advocate against purchasing hedgehogs from pet stores as well. In my opinion, feeling sorry for the hedgehog isn't reason enough. By making that purchase, you give your business to the store that isn't providing them with correct care, isn't socializing them, housing males and females together, and so on. You may take that specific hedgehog out of a bad situation, but by paying for it, you're enabling and encouraging the store to get another hedgehog to replace it. You're telling them that hedgehogs sell, hedgehogs will make them money, and they'll keep doing it.

The best thing you can do for the pathetic, under-socialized, poorly cared for hedgehog you see in a pet store is to walk away. Talk to the manager or owner; they're usually not receptive, but it's worth a try to inform them and get them to improve the care they give to the hedgehogs in the store.

Or ask to see their USDA license (which stores are required to have to sell exotic animals, including hedgehogs) - and if they don't have one, you can report them. In a lot of cases, stores that only sell one or two hedgehogs now and then will slip under the radar without having a license, and the only enforcement of that requirement happens when the USDA is made aware of it by someone reporting them.

I just don't think it's worth it. When you buy a hedgehog from a pet store, you're continuing the cycle and helping to ensure that the store will have hedgehogs "in stock". That alone should be enough reason to purchase from a breeder instead, but if it's not enough, my first post gives plenty of other reasons. You're paying more (a lot more, when you consider the increased vet costs, whether they happen right away or in a year or two) compared to a hedgehog from a breeder, but you're getting so much less.


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## ponylover317 (Nov 20, 2012)

moxieberry said:


> ... You may take that specific hedgehog out of a bad situation, but by paying for it, you're enabling and encouraging the store to get another hedgehog to replace it. You're telling them that hedgehogs sell, hedgehogs will make them money, and they'll keep doing it......
> 
> Or ask to see their USDA license (which stores are required to have to sell exotic animals, including hedgehogs) - and if they don't have one, you can report them. In a lot of cases, stores that only sell one or two hedgehogs now and then will slip under the radar without having a license, and the only enforcement of that requirement happens when the USDA is made aware of it by someone reporting them.
> 
> I just don't think it's worth it. When you buy a hedgehog from a pet store, you're continuing the cycle and helping to ensure that the store will have hedgehogs "in stock". That alone should be enough reason to purchase from a breeder instead, but if it's not enough, my first post gives plenty of other reasons. You're paying more (a lot more, when you consider the increased vet costs, whether they happen right away or in a year or two) compared to a hedgehog from a breeder, but you're getting so much less.


Amen


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## aydree (Oct 19, 2012)

Ok thanks guys. The nearest breeder is still pretty far away and charges a 95 dollar delivery fee.. And on top on the 200-250 for her hogs, that over 300$ and that's before I buy food, a cage, a heating source,etc..not to mention a vet fund. So I was thinking about a pet store nearby because I think it would be cheaper and I do feel sorry for their living conditions but I shouldn't condone it by giving said store my business. I'm just going to wait a bit longer and go about things the way ill feel most comfortable and not worry about money because I'd rather have that extra little bit of expected longevity.


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## moxieberry (Nov 30, 2011)

Where are you located?


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## AtomicHedgie (Jan 20, 2012)

I got Gimli from a pet store and he is wonderful. He rarely raises his quills he has never bitten me. We've had no health problems and he's just wonderful.


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## ponylover317 (Nov 20, 2012)

aydree said:


> Ok thanks guys. The nearest breeder is still pretty far away and charges a 95 dollar delivery fee.. And on top on the 200-250 for her hogs, that over 300$ and that's before I buy food, a cage, a heating source,etc..not to mention a vet fund. So I was thinking about a pet store nearby because I think it would be cheaper and I do feel sorry for their living conditions but I shouldn't condone it by giving said store my business. I'm just going to wait a bit longer and go about things the way ill feel most comfortable and not worry about money because I'd rather have that extra little bit of expected longevity.


I would look for other breeders, I bet there has to be at least one in your area with hedgies for that price or less, see if you can find one you can drive to rather than ship....I understand how expensive all this must be for you.

I got Layla for 165$, and I only had to drive about an hour and a half to get her....of course this may not be available to many people, but I really think you should look at as many breeders as possible before you look at pet stores....


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## Chihirolee3 (Nov 27, 2012)

When I first looked into getting a hedgehog, I never even thought about a pet store because I have never seen one at any I have been to (I own a cat and feed him Blue Buffalo, which is only availible at pet stores). I did not know then that pet stores could carry hedgehogs. I thought they were an immensly exotic animal since the information out there in books is so out of date and incorrect. I live on the Iowa/MN border and just internet searched for breeders in my area. There was one in Killduff, IA, one in Winona Mn, and there were a few in the Cities. We are going through the one in Winona since my husband went to school there (and thus we know the area), and it's such a scenic drive. I almost went through a breeder up near Rollag, mn, and that would have been a 7 hour drive, and I couldn't bear to imagine a baby hedgie traveling as mail!! Overall, it took a while to find someone near us, but the search is worth it. You may have to do some real digging to find a breeder in your area. I would just google "hedgehog breeder near _____(insert city and state where you reside)". Worked for me, but again it takes a bit of digging...


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## Shell (Aug 23, 2012)

I got Percy at 7 weeks old from a pet store for $75 (they were having a 30% off sale) and he's a doll. No health issues and a very happy boy. It's a small family run pet store that only brings in two hedgy's from a local breeder at a time. The shop was spotless and they told me if I had any troubles with health, they would back me up. I've gone back for mealie's and accessories and they always ask how he's doing. I lucked out, but having worked in pet stores in my younger days, I wouldn't have got a hedgehog in one of the larger pet shops. You just have ro be careful. There's no guarantee a hedgy won't get sick or have a bad personality no matter where you get one from. With a breeder though, you can watch your baby grow up with photo's and ask the breeder about the personality, ect..


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## Chihirolee3 (Nov 27, 2012)

I guess when it comes to any pet from pet stores, there's a bit you should learn prior to attaining an animal from one (Shell brought up a good point [btw, adorable hedgie is adorable  ]) You should learn where they get their animals, (talking to the owner or manager is a good start). It would be good to also get as much info as you can about a specific animal before you buy it (just because it looks sick now doesn't mean it has always been sick, and what are THEY doing to help the poor thing get better?) It would be good to also spend some time observing all the animals you are interested in (some places let you even play with them or hold them). Just like with a breeder, there are many questions one would want to answer before picking a breeder for any animal, the same goes with pet stores. Larger chain pet stores are no where near as ideal as a breeder, but if you happen to come across a pet store that may be small (family owned) and/or really keep the animals livelyhood in mind, you will have much better luck finding a healthy little bumbler to call your own


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## moxieberry (Nov 30, 2011)

There's a pet store in our area that advertises that their hedgehogs come from a particular breeder, and they come with pedigree and known lineage. To a potential buyer, that might seem the same as buying from a reputable breeder - it's not. In this particular case, it's a wholesale "breeder" from a completely different state (midwest, and we're in WA) whose lines have a reputation for being riddled with WHS. The pet store has a page on their website about hedgehog care, which includes recommending tanks and Iams or Science Diet as the best foods. They may be well intentioned, but it's still a pet store.

No reputable breeder, as far as I'm concerned, would sell to a pet store. I would not trust anyone but myself (and my fiance/partner, of course) to make a decision on who a baby goes to. Pet stores don't screen their buyers - even the best of them. They're businesses. They purchase the hedgehogs (and other animals) with the intention of selling them for a higher price. A breeder who sells babies to that kind of situation doesn't have the babies' welfare as a top priority, and that goes hand in hand with breeding priorities overall.

Do you think a breeder who is willing to sell to a pet store, and therefore have no control over where their babies ends up, cares enough about hedgehogs in general to work toward bettering the species and ensuring that their lines are clean? Or do you think a breeder who is willing to sell to a pet store, to have the hedgehog left alone in a cage for weeks or even months before being purhcased, without regular handling or socialization, is going to take the necessary time to handle them as young, pre-weaned babies and give the babies individual attention to help their temperaments flourish?

Some sources that pet stores get hedgehogs from might be better, but only by comparison to other sources that also sell to pet stores. Compared to a legitimate, reputable, dedicated breeder - no, there's no comparison.

It is absolutely possible to get sweet, well-mannered, healthy hedgehogs from pet stores. Being from a pet store doesn't automatically make a hedgehog a "bad" pet. But, regardless, I can never support or recommend purchasing one from there. If there's a reputable breeder available, even if it's out of the way, even if it's a long waiting list, that is always the better option.


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## Christemo (Oct 5, 2011)

What's rather funny is that my hog from a petstore is much more social than the one I got from a breeder. They've been held the same amount of time and socialized the same while they've been with me.


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## LizardGirl (Aug 25, 2008)

moxieberry said:


> There's a pet store in our area that advertises that their hedgehogs come from a particular breeder, and they come with pedigree and known lineage. To a potential buyer, that might seem the same as buying from a reputable breeder - it's not. In this particular case, it's a wholesale "breeder" from a completely different state (midwest, and we're in WA) whose lines have a reputation for being riddled with WHS. The pet store has a page on their website about hedgehog care, which includes recommending tanks and Iams or Science Diet as the best foods. They may be well intentioned, but it's still a pet store.
> 
> No reputable breeder, as far as I'm concerned, would sell to a pet store. I would not trust anyone but myself (and my fiance/partner, of course) to make a decision on who a baby goes to. Pet stores don't screen their buyers - even the best of them. They're businesses. They purchase the hedgehogs (and other animals) with the intention of selling them for a higher price. A breeder who sells babies to that kind of situation doesn't have the babies' welfare as a top priority, and that goes hand in hand with breeding priorities overall.
> 
> ...


This is a great post, and highlights my main concern about people who buy from pet stores. It's not really about how the pet will turn out (because pet store animals can be great, I've seen plenty, though they usually have started off with health problems) but who you're supporting by buying from a pet store. Temperaments aren't something that can be guaranteed through good handling. Hedgies can be hit or miss once they go home and go through quilling. I've seen great of both. If I didn't care at all about ensuring the welfare of future hedgehogs and not supporting stupid people doing stupid things, and I found a pet store hedgehog that was friendly and actually healthy, then that would be great! But if you have the option of buying from a breeder, wouldn't you want to know your hedgehog's birthdate? The health and temperament of their parents? Support someone trying to eradicate WHS instead of just breeding the first two animals they come across? There is a lot of "fine print" about what you're really supporting when you buy from a pet store.


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