# Temperature fluctuations?



## Harleythehog (Aug 18, 2013)

I hope this doesn't seem like a stupid question, but I keep wondering why the temperature cannot fluctuate? I mean I understand why they need to be warm, but why can't it fluctuate a bit? I am sure that in the wild (even in Africa), the temp drops at night and during different weather patterns, i.e. rain season, cold spells, heat spells, etc. Why is it so important then that our hedgie's cannot have temp that fluctuates. Do their bodies not get accustomed to slight changes? Thanks for commenting.


----------



## Annie&Tibbers (Apr 16, 2013)

My guess:

Our little friends are hybrids of a bunch of breeds. Somewhere along the line in the domesticating process, the whole hibernate system broke. Temperature sensitivity, waking up, everything. The "no fluctuations" rule isn't so much something learned from watching their wild cousins, as something learned from hard experience as owners had mistakes happen at home. 

I suspect that just like some hedgehogs handle cold better than others (mine's current preferred temperature is other's minimum temperature), some probably handle fluctuations better. Breeders probably could try selecting for temperature tolerance, but are more concerned with temperament, health, and appearance, so that's probably not going to happen until our small friends are much more domesticated than they are today.


----------



## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

Annie covered it pretty well. And like she said, some do handle fluctuations better than others - but it's hard to tell what they'll be good with, and what they won't, so we generally err on the side of caution & recommend to keep the fluctuation to a minimum (maybe 1-2 degrees on either side of your optimal temp). They also tend to handle temperature changes and/or cooler temperatures better when they're younger, but that's far from a hard-and-fast rule. Lily was only 1-1.5 years when she started getting really temperature-sensitive. She did fine if the temperature went up (it got up to 85-86* in my room during the summers, much to my displeasure), as long as it didn't drop too quickly afterwards. But her temp range was about 78-81*. If it went below 78, I'd end up finding her with a cool belly.


----------



## unforgiven (Apr 26, 2013)

Interesting. I have been wondering about this also and have been keeping a close eye on Lucy. I live in Florida so it doesn't get too cold here. We keep our house on 77 or 78 in the summer and she has been fine. She always grumps and puffs when we first wake her up then she opens her eyes and ready to come out full of spunk. It is getting cooler here now and we keep the house at 72 in the winter. The past couple of nights it has cooled off and the house has been at 72. I checked her and she doesn't seem any different. She is cozy in her pile of fleece in her igloo and has waken right up as usual. She is 7 months old and I now know she might become more sensitive as she gets older.


----------



## Harleythehog (Aug 18, 2013)

Yes very interesting. I also thought I would point out that I live in Canada where the weather gets very cold in the winter. Now and then I run into other hedgehog owners and start up a conversation about our little prickly friends. Much to my surprise, the majority of them don't even realize they need additional heat source. They just keep them in their house with their normal room temp and luckily none of them have ever experienced hibernation. The person with the oldest Hedgie I spoke with was more the 2 years old. So, I don't know if based on the fact the hedgies are born in a cold climate and that their predecessors are also from colder climate, that they have been acclimatized to our temps. My Harley is doing well (knock on wood) with 70-72 temp and at this, she evens seems hot as I often see her sprawled out trying to cool off, and she avoids the part of her cage where I have the heating pad. Of note, I know the heating pad is not too hot as I check it everyday by putting my wrist on top of the area. It's only slightly warm to the touch.

I would like to hear more comments of others who do not use additional heating. I know the consensus here is to use it, but I am investigating whether there's another side to the coin, so to speak.


----------



## Annie&Tibbers (Apr 16, 2013)

My tiny Canadian hoglet (less than 1 year old) hates hot temperatures (above 78F), and is totally happy & most energetic at 72-74F. He got distinctly less active (ran ~100m/night instead of ~3-10km/night) but ate the same & had a warm belly when we tried out ambient house temperature (68-70F)


----------



## LittleWontonPoo (Aug 31, 2013)

I try to keep Wontons cage to be at least 20 degrees Celcius (68 degrees), mainly because she is in my room (she doesn't have an external source of heat other than...), and I use an oil heater (...this at night), so it generally stays around that temperature. Wonton "seems" to be fine living with the lower end of the temperature spectrum, but I do get paranoid, because it's almost the middle of the winter season here. Surprisingly the weather is still pretty forgiving. 

Also, I give her a thick blanket to huddle in. Is that alright? Because when I pick her up after she has been napping in the blankie for a while, she is super warm; I can almost define it as "hot". 

I honestly plan on grabbing a CHE any way though, because I prefer to play it safe. I need to let my heart be at peace! From the beginning, I always worried about the temperature since my house is rather cold and being in an Asian family, mom doesn't like to "unnecessarily" turn on the heat, haha. 

Also, I am a little curious about the term "cool". It's a little ambiguous, because when are hedgies' bellies considered cool? My boyfriend and I had an argument about it, because from my understanding, "cool" is when their bellies don't feel too warm, but the warmth is still there (subtle). He thinks if hedgies have a cool belly, they are close to death (I don't get his logic). What are your suggestions, hedgie fam?

On an unrelated topic, Annie&Tibbers, what device do you use to track the distance travelled on the wheel?


----------



## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

I'd go with your interpretation of "cool", personally. There's a difference between "cool" and "cold". Cool would be beginning stages of hibernation attempt, I think, and cold would be after they've been in an attempt for a little while. Cool is also easier to get them warmed back up than cold, since they're not as far into it. Lily attempted hibernation numerous times, with her temp sensitivity. I mostly caught her in the "cool" stage and it didn't take overly long to warm her up - maybe 15-20 minutes? I usually kept her out longer than that, of course, but she warmed up fairly quickly.

I don't remember if I ever caught Lily "cold" before, but I do remember checking on a couple of hedgehogs a pet store near me had once - I'd been keeping an eye on them, and this time when I went in, one of them was wobbly walking. I instantly got her out (they didn't have the cage locked for some reason, and by then they knew me as the "hedgehog girl" :lol and she was COLD. I demanded heat for them and spent the next 30-45 minutes walking around the store with her under my shirt to get her warmed up - longer than it usually took Lily when I caught her "cool". That hedgie did warm up though, and as far as I know, ended up being fine - they were given a CHE and were warm on my other visits, and both ended up getting homes. And that pet store hasn't attempted to get hedgehogs again, heh. 

Sorry, this is a bit of a rambling answer. :lol: At any rate, I wouldn't consider either stage to be literally "close to death". It may certainly feel like they are - especially when they're outright cold, which makes your heart skip a beat even if you've dealt with it before (I know I flinched when I picked that poor girl up in the pet store). But most times, you can pull them out of it still, especially since you're going to be catching them before it's been very long.


----------



## Annie&Tibbers (Apr 16, 2013)

I hate having to figure out if something is wrong by the "cool" method, because what if he's only "coolER" than he usually is? Is he actually cooler, or am I just overheated & warmer than usual? Ugh.

I use a bicycle odometer. I picked up a Filzer dZ2L Cycling Compute from MEC, but you can use anything that automatically turns on and off. The Schwinn Bike Pedometer & Computer seems popular with the American forum users; here's a few other suggestions. And here's instructions on how to set it up.


----------



## Draenog (Feb 27, 2012)

I think the whole 'no fluctuation' thing is something more the 'American way' of hedgehog housing... it's pretty common in my country (and others here as well) to have different temps for day and night, with night being a bit lower (like 25C during the day and 22C during the night). 

Our pet hedgehogs can hibernate. I know someone (a vet actually) who let his hedgehogs hibernate every year. It's not like they can't hibernate because they're domesticated - they just need to be prepared. They need to store enough fat, and get into hibernation slowly. Unprepared hedgehogs get sick when they attempt hibernation.
So no, I don't think slight fluctuations are a huge deal, but big drops in temperature could trigger hibernation.


----------



## LittleWontonPoo (Aug 31, 2013)

Draenog, maybe you have the European hedgehog, unlike most of us with the African Pygmy? They are native to Europe, so they are used to the climate there, hence they can easily prepare themselves for hibernation, I suppose  

Thanks Annie&Tibbers! I will include a bike odometer into my online shopping cart...Along with the CHE equipment, sigh, there goes half my pay on Wonton. That spoiled little poo. She hasn't been very active recently, so I want to see if she is actually running on the wheel without me hearing her (I must be so beaten up with school work if that's the case, hahaha), or she is just taking a little rest from running...Hrm...She slowed down on her eating too. Eeks.

I also have the problem of determining if she is cool because I am warm, or if she is warm because I am cold, haha. So I am still a little "meh" about it, and it doesn't seem to be a dependable method. ): 

Anyway, back to the original topic: 
It's not that temperature cannot fluctuate at all, but more like the temperature cannot drop below the tolerance level of that individual hedgehog (since each and every one of them have different temperature sensitivities). If the house goes down a degree or two, I am pretty sure the hedgie can handle it, unless the initial temperature is already way too low to begin with (in my opinion, lower than 20*C). 

There is also the case of a sudden drop of temperature. Unless you like to take your hedgie from your super warm house into the wintry conditions outside, there won't be a "sudden drop of temperature", because if temperature is to go down naturally, it is a gradual process. 

Bottom line is, it's all about consistency. It is better to have the hedgie at a temperature that he/she will be comfortable with, and KEEP the temperature there, because the hedgie won't be experiencing problems such as a hibernation attempt.

Like what Lilysmommy said, minimal fluctuations is *recommended*, but not limited to.


----------



## Annie&Tibbers (Apr 16, 2013)

Oh! For just checking on if she's running at all, you can also just dust her wheel with flour and check for tiny footprints. It doesn't give you the 100m vs the 1km measurement, though.

I kinda disagree about natural = gradual. Some places I've lived have really severe day/night temperature swings of over 10C, one even regularly did a 20C difference.


----------



## LittleWontonPoo (Aug 31, 2013)

Oh my, I forgot to take into account about the different locations with those drastic temperature changes. But honestly, if I lived in an area that is notorious for great temperature drops, I would go straight for additional heat sources for my hedgie. 

And that's a pretty good method! I will try that tonight, but I cringe at the thought of her making a mess everywhere, haha.


----------



## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

I'm not sure I believe that our domesticated hedgehogs can hibernate if they build up enough fat. If that were the case, hedgehogs that have only been hibernating for a day or two, should be able to come out of it as. This rarely happens and usually they end up dieing. I will see if I can get some hedgie experts to weigh in on this. 

Not all hedgehogs are going to be affected by a temperature drop but some will. I've had a few over the years who couldn't handle it. Emma in particular was sensitive to drops. 30 other hedgehogs in the room when the temperature dropped and she'd be the only one affected. IMO, it's easier to keep the temperature consistent.

There have been many discussions about temperature on the forums and lists and among owners over the years and the general consensus has been that "most" hedgehogs do best at 75F. It has been noted by many that even if some hedgies do okay at a lower temperature, often the hedgehog is much more active and happy at a warmer temperature.


----------



## Draenog (Feb 27, 2012)

Sorry for my late reply I totally forgot about this thread :roll:

I was talking about APHs. Keeping European hedgehogs as pets is illegal.

Like I said, this vet lets his APHs hibernate every winter. He keeps them in a cold room but they still have food available because they can wake up sometimes during the hibernation period to eat something before going back to sleep. I would never try it though, I would be worrying all the time. I don't know how he prepares everything though, but I think he just lets them go into hibernation slowly and gradually. But it's not like they absolutely can't hibernate anymore.


----------

