# Not bonding well, what am I doing wrong? (Newbie owner)



## Scarlet (Sep 19, 2013)

I adopted a 6-week-old hedgehog about 4 weeks ago (I named him "Peanut Pepper Page") and I don't feel like he is getting used to us or improving much as far as bonding or taming. 
Peanut still doesn't want me to pick him up and will spike me every time I touch him unless he's already in my hand (and even then, he'll spike me if he feels anything touching him that he didn't move towards, like if I try gently to stroke his quills on the backside.) He still jumps and hisses at every little shadow that crosses his vision and any medium to loud sounds. He doesn't seem to be much interested in playing with his toys (just the running wheels occasionally... he just hides under the other toys I've given him.) He eats well and poops well and seems otherwise pretty healthy.

Here is what I do: 

1.) Every day when I come home, I take off one of my socks and place it in his bed, then place the other one in his sleepy-sack/bonding pouch. (I figure I've been wearing it all day, so it smells like me, right?)

2.) Every night when the sun goes down, I open his cage and move his house to wake him up. Then, a few minutes later, I'll gently take him out of his cage and place him in his playpen to wake up even further. Then, a few minutes later, I'll either put him in his sleepy sack and put him on my lap or will just put him straight into my lap and watch TV or mess around on the computer for at least 30 minutes to 2 hours. (He usually just curls up and hides/sleeps and will hiss/spike every time I move a muscle. Sometimes he'll try to explore me a little, but seems to just be looking for a better place to hide.) He won't let me pick him up at first and will curl into a tight ball, so I have to use a fleecie or a sock to get him out, but once he's in his playpen he only spikes at me, doesn't curl up all the way and I can usually get my fingers gently under him and support his legs. (But one time, he did nip me when I tried to pick him up and got my fingers caught in his orbicularis as he was curling up.)

3.) Later in the evening, after TV time, I'll sit with him in his playpen and either let him walk around exploring or will hold him and let him walk from one hand to the next (I call this "the treadmill game" because he keeps running along my hand and arm and I'll have to catch him with the next hand to keep him falling off, repeat ad-neuseum until my arms get tired.) Usually when he's exploring, he'll just look for something to hide under, like a toy or my knee.

4.) I try to talk to him constantly and in a gentle tone of voice all throughout playtime and often when he's in his playpen (not as much when I'm watching TV, though, for obvious reasons.) 

5.) While he is sitting on my lap, my knee or in my hand, I will (every 3 days or so) offer him a favorite treat (a mealie, some cheese or some egg white) which he eagerly eats, but still seems very tense about it. 

I'm just not sure what I'm doing wrong! Is it normal for them to take this long to get used to you? 
I was shocked, because one day he actually let me stroke his backside quills without hissing and jumping, but he hasn't let me do that in the week since.
-Scarlet Page


----------



## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

It sounds like you're doing everything right. My only suggestion is to try to have the lights dim, or maybe just the tv on for light when you have him out. Some hedgehogs just take longer to get used to you, it can take a few months.


----------



## Scarlet (Sep 19, 2013)

Yeah, usually the lights are low when hes out. I didnt know it could take months. I kept seeing things saying in only took a few weeks for them to start opening up. Imguess i just have to persevere!
Thanks!


----------



## zamxonk (Mar 6, 2013)

Also, keep in mind that the hiding may not be all about fright. My hedgie kept hiding during playtime for about the first month and a half I had him, because he was sleepy. Babies sleep A LOT, and yours is only 10 weeks. 

My hedgie still hates to be picked up, will prickle up or try to bite me or both, while hissing like a teakettle. I've had him for 3 months now, and handle him every single day. That may not change. What did change is that he's mostly stopped raising his quills at me in other situations - he'll just huff and jump, quills flat. It's pretty silly. 

One good way to practice petting is to bring your hand towards him from the front (so he sees it coming) very slowly, and stroke your whole hand from his nose to his butt, smoothing his quills down as much as you can in the process. If he quills up, sometimes this can help them go back down. 

Playing music during handling can help lessen the startle effect of random noises (for the first few weeks, my hedgie surely thought that every book page turn signaled his demise, then someone on the forum suggested playing music, and he stopped flipping out about it. Now he trusts me so much that if he's sleeping on me, he doesn't even twitch at sudden noises). 

With the socks, do you leave them in there all night? Also keep in mind that different parts of your body smell different, so he might not recognize your torso-smell as part of the same animal as your foot-smell. Your socks will also smell like your shoes. I'd recommend wearing a t-shirt to bed several nights in a row, because the sheets will close in your smell and it will smell more like you than clothes you wear out and about.
I also am a proponent of putting the snuggle bag under your shirt. It will surround them with your scent and keep them warmer at the same time. Only need to worry if your hedgie is a biter who will climb out of the bag to chew on ya. 

Does your hedgie enjoy the treadmill game? Mine definitely doesn't, although I do a bit of it every night because I need him to be used to being handled by my hands. My boy is definitely an explorer and any attempt to interfere with his nighttime wanderings is met with copious hissing. He does enjoy trying to burrow under my legs and butt if I sit in his playpen though.

Good luck, I hope some of that was helpful.


----------



## Erizo (Jul 25, 2012)

Sophie is about the friendliest hedgie I can imagine. She was well socialized by the breeder; I got her on her six week birthday; we have generous together time every day; she is 20 months old now --- and she's the biggest scaredy cat ever. It takes nothing at all for her to flair her quills up.

She's not serious about it - doesn't hiss and the quills come right down - but your hedgie is still a just a baby. Stay the course and he'll likely get better, bit by bit. Sophie generally does not like to be petted at all. She does (for whatever reason) LOVE being petted during our three-a-week foot-and-belly baths. I don't know why. It took many, many months. But we started making progress and before you know it she loves it. But at no other time am I allowed to pet her. Go figure. Nuances of personality and behavior, and how they can shift -- that's something you learn a little bit more about every day and the learning never ends.

Sophie has zero interest in toys. She loves her wheel. She loves her tunnels. She sleeps or hides 20+ hours a day even now. Almost all of our together time is her sleeping with me. That's fine. The best part of my day is a late afternoon nap. I lie down and she runs up inside my shirt and sleeps under my shoulder.

1. I agree with the advice that putting one of your shirts in the cage is probably a lot better than socks. You probably aren't getting much benefit there. (If you've been wearing the shirt for just part of the day, that's still plenty.)

2. What you are doing sounds fine. It hasn't been very long. He may always be jumpy. It's a primal instinct. In time the 'seriousness' will probably lessen significantly.

3. Some hedgies like being handled. Some don't. Sophie does not. She is perfectly happy to sleep with me in my bed, at my desk, and so forth -- but if she is awake and alert, she really wants to be left alone to roam her cage as she pleases. Some hedgies love their play areas. Sophie came to hate hers. She really, really does not like being out of her cage if she is awake and active. (Her cage is huge (more than 25 sq. ft.) which helps a lot I think.)

You just never know what a hedgehog will like or dislike and reading the signs is difficult.

4. This is good. I think that they should be exposed (within reason) to the natural flow of the day and night as regards sound. Being extra cautious and careful I think can create an unnatural environment and expectation.

5. If he is eagerly eating treats, then you should declare victory. Tenseness will diminish over time. Sophie loves her mealworms. They are the only thing that I can hand feed. She loves crickets also, but really does not like to take them from me at all. Yet she will root through every square inch of her cage during the night to make sure she's gotten every one I've put out. Go figure.


TIME. Just stay with it every day. You may not notice the increased trust and comfort level day to day, but it will almost certainly happen. Sophie used to think that bath time was a torture. Now it's one of her very favorite things. That was many months in the making. I can look back and see all the little milestones of behavior changes.


----------



## Scarlet (Sep 19, 2013)

Thanks guys! I'm so new at this, wasn't sure what to expect! I'm sure there's tiny increments of change and last night he even let me pet his backside quills again without much fuss, so I guess there's some growth after all. I'm going to give him my night shirt tomorrow..
The only reason I don't give him my shirts is that I don't want him to rip them or stain them with his poopy (I don't have many clothes to spare and I often wear delicate fabrics) and the t-shirts that I CAN spare... well, he was chewing on that shiny ink they use on t-shirts once while I was wearing one and I didn't want him to eat it or hurt himself with it! I'll have to sleep with some of his fleecie bedding squares under my shirt.
Does he enjoy the treadmill game? It's hard to say. He keeps doing it, but I think he's just looking for a safe place. I'm just doing it to get him used to my hands and being handled, but he's not hissing the whole time and seems relatively calm, only when something startles him does he jump.
Thanks!!
-Scarlet


----------



## zamxonk (Mar 6, 2013)

Putting his fleece under your blankets with you at night would totally work. 

I totally agree about the treadmill game being necessary to some degree to let them know they have to deal with a certain amount of hand-time. I wouldn't do it more than that if your hedgie doesn't enjoy it. After 5 minutes, Ambrose starts threatening to bite me because he is so annoyed that he can see the floor and JUST. CAN'T. REACH. IT. 

Good luck to you and your hedgie, he's lucky to have you!


----------



## raurora (Sep 6, 2013)

Quick jump in here: If you are still bonding with your hedgie and doing the whole 'sit on my lap while I play on my computer' thing because he tends to flare up if you move, should you try to pick him up? He plays treadmill or burrow into my armpit game when I do hold him. Hes just quilling and I dont want to pick him up or stress him out


----------



## zamxonk (Mar 6, 2013)

It's okay to pick him up, just don't keep him awake for more than a few minutes during the day. When they're quilling, they might be super grumpy, and I wouldn't handle their backs too much, but it's okay to hold them.

If it is night and your hedgie is active and grumpy and running away, and won't nap in your lap, then there is no power in the 'verse that can get them to lie down and sleep in your lap (except maybe a bright light, but that can mess with their noctural rhythm), so it might be playpen time!


----------



## Scarlet (Sep 19, 2013)

How can I tell if hes quilling? He loses about five baby quills a day on average, but ive had him between 6 weeks to now 11 weeks, shouldnt he have started quilling by now? I dont know what to look for, but i dont see any larger quills or any new quills poking through and no real gaps or anything? 
-Scarlet


----------



## MartinAndMe (Aug 26, 2013)

It sounds like you're doing a remarkable job. Please please please don't be discouraged. Hedgehogs have a variety of personalities. Mine's a very shy boy, and it sounds like yours might be too. Shy hedgehogs are naturally more timid of their owners and may seem to be resisting playtime, but trust me, your efforts are worthwhile. May I give you some advice that helped out with my guy?
Get your baby a blanket and sleep with it for a night (or use a shirt you've worn but not yet washed) and carry him around in it. It smells like you and it's something he can nestle into without feeling threatened. Let him stay calm. If you touch him and he gets upset, wait for a while to try again. Let him associate your smell with calmness. Try letting him lie in the blanket while you hold it and watch a movie. It worked wonders for Martin. And the simple fact that you've got a young baby is part of it, too. They spend almost all their time asleep and so he's likely not too thrilled to be awake. Keep trying. It WILL pay off, I promise.


----------

