# Not wheeling or eating..



## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

A few of you know that I posted a bit ago about my fears of Alaska having a URI, but because of bad weather and the holiday yesterday, I was unable to make a vet appointment.
My fears are just increasing now. 

- How old is your hedgehog? 9ish months.
- How long have you owned your hedgehog? Almost 3 weeks.
- Has there been any changes in the 2-3 weeks prior to the symptoms starting, such as, you on vacation, hedgie cared for by someone else, new cage, different cage location etc? Moved in with me - she was with LizardGirl for (2-3?) weeks as a rescue and before that with her original owner.
- What is the temperature of the hedgehogs cage? 74 average, (76 at highest, 72 at lowest.)
- What is the lighting schedule? 6:30am-8pm.

Last night when I went to check on Alaska (At around 5pm) she came out of her igloo and let me pick her up without any balling up which was unusual. I brought her out and she slept on my boyfriend and I (depending on who she decided had a warmer tummy  ) until 7:30ish. 
I put her back in her cage and turned the light out then went to drop my boyfriend off at home. 
When I came home, I checked on her again, and she was in her wheel, just sitting. The wheel wasn't swaying as if she had just stopped running, so I assumed she had just gotten on when I startled her with the light.

I left again, and around 10:30 when I went to bed, I found her on her wheel again. Usually, there's a ton of poop and an active Alaska at this point - but not last night. There was barely any poop on her wheel and she was asleep on the wheel again.
Her food was barely touched all night and there's not anymore poop on the wheel than there was last night.
She's still sneezing quite a bit (but yesterday her nose was mostly dry). 
The poop I could look at wasn't extremely abnormal, just very minimal. Seemed a bit long and skinny rather than blobs of it, though.

I _know_ she needs to go to the vet - just any help/warnings would be greatly appreciated!


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## cthom (Nov 15, 2011)

Hudini has been haveing the same problem for the past 3 days. we just moved.

he was constipated. try putting her in a warm bath and rubbing her tummy for a while. i did that with dini and boy did he poop! 
i feed him some apple sauce and that seemed to help to. are you switching her foods at all? that can be a culprate. and ive heard pumkin (the unspiced kind) or squash is good for consipation (read it on the fourm). i dont think they can run because its uncomfertable on them when the are constipated. dini was drinking jut fine to but he really didnt want to run around or eat. and try to lay off the mealies. i found that that made it worse. i hope that helps! but she is a baby so maybe a vet trip wouldent be a bad idea! 

after i got dini to poop he ran on his wheel all night agian. right as rain. give it a try and see what happens. 
hope that helps!


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

cthom said:


> Hudini has been haveing the same problem for the past 3 days. we just moved.
> 
> he was constipated. try putting her in a warm bath and rubbing her tummy for a while. i did that with dini and boy did he poop!
> i feed him some apple sauce and that seemed to help to. are you switching her foods at all? that can be a culprate. and ive heard pumkin (the unspiced kind) or squash is good for consipation (read it on the fourm). i dont think they can run because its uncomfertable on them when the are constipated. dini was drinking jut fine to but he really didnt want to run around or eat. and try to lay off the mealies. i found that that made it worse. i hope that helps! but she is a baby so maybe a vet trip wouldent be a bad idea!
> ...


Her food has been the same since she moved in, but that may have something to do with it. When I started mixing in the new cat food with what she arrived with, she would only eat the cat food and would hide her previous food. So her diet has changed, but it's been that way the entire time now. I'll try a bath and see if that helps! Thanks!


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

She needs to see a vet NOW and should have been there already. It was 5 days ago when you posted you were concerned she might have a URI. In that length of time it could easily turn to pneumonia. Loss of appetite is one of the symptoms that a URI has turned. She needs to see a vet TODAY, I cannot stress this enough.


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## jerseymike1126 (Jan 20, 2011)

if you cant get an appointment with your vet, most areas have a clinic open 24-7. even if they are not very knowledgeable with hedgies they would be able to give you the right dosage of small animal batryl! go asap


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

Nancy said:


> She needs to see a vet NOW and should have been there already. It was 5 days ago when you posted you were concerned she might have a URI. In that length of time it could easily turn to pneumonia. Loss of appetite is one of the symptoms that a URI has turned. She needs to see a vet TODAY, I cannot stress this enough.


There has been snow and very icy roads. Though I love Alaska so much, I cannot put myself in danger driving to the vet in this weather. I realize she needs to go, thank you.


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

jerseymike1126 said:


> if you cant get an appointment with your vet, most areas have a clinic open 24-7. even if they are not very knowledgeable with hedgies they would be able to give you the right dosage of small animal batryl! go asap


I'll try to find one and see if it's closer to my house than the other vet because of road conditions. Thanks Mike!


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## jerseymike1126 (Jan 20, 2011)

i just hope she is ok, if she is not active and not eating then it has gotten bad. sooner she gets meds the better. waiting can be fatal


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## LizardGirl (Aug 25, 2008)

Jackie, if you or your parents can't drive, please find a friend of some sort with a car that can. I don't want you to lose Alaska within a month of having her.


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## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

Taxis run in all kinds of weather and road conditions, maybe this would be an option?


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## Stellara (Nov 12, 2011)

Since she has a runny nose, I would Highly doubt this is due to constipation. Most likely she has an illness that is causing the lack of appetite and the lethargy, which in turn obviously means less poop. Because of this, there is nothing you can do until you get her to the vet to get medication. I have seen so many people lose young/small animals to things that a simple med probably could have helped. If she is not drinking you can give her fluids carefully, but until she is put on a suitable antibiotic she will get worse and worse. I would try to keep her room at a more constant and warm temperature since temp fluctuations are the last thing she needs right now. Remember that exotic animals many times hide their illnesses. WHen they are to the point where they even begin to exhibit symptoms it is past the time they should be to the vet, so we must race them to one as soon as we suspect something. We had very rough weather the day I had to bring Stella back to her vet. I ended up driving during light-time so it was less dangerous and had a friend go with me. Maybe someone with much experience driving would help since this is urgent. I agree that if you cannot drive to your regular vet, find any vet that you can get to that will prescribe the medication she needs- at this point, she needs it today and should not go another night without it. Keep us updated, I hope you are able to get the meds so your baby girl can start feeling better!


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

The soonest the vet could get her in is tomorrow morning - will update you all then. Thank you all!


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## LarryT (May 12, 2009)

JackieMackk said:


> The soonest the vet could get her in is tomorrow morning - will update you all then. Thank you all!


 That's great!  Praying everything will be back to normal in a few days.


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

Alaska is happily wheeling, pooping and eating tonight. 
Of course we'll still be going tomorrow, I just thought I'd share this good news


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## jerseymike1126 (Jan 20, 2011)

that is a good sign, hopefully with a little bit of meds she will be good


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## nualasmom (Nov 13, 2011)

Any update on Alaska since the vet visit? I hope everything turned out well.


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

Finally have some time to sit and tell you all everything. 

The vet was great, Alaska was friendly as always and the vet was surprised at how she didn't ball up or hiss at her once. (She only got a bit scare when she wanted to look at her teeth, which are fantastic apparently)

She said that she was glad I got her in soon but even then her URI didn't seen too awful and was definitely just in her nose and wasn't spreading at all yet, so that was good news!
She gave me baytril to give two times a day and said it should clear up in a week or so.

The only thing she did say was that I should consider changing Alaska's diet from cat food to hedgehog food? (she recommended this, http://www.petstore.com/Pretty_Pets_Pre ... hwodsmnroQ) 
She also said I shouldn't feed Alaska meal worms to get her weight up because of the protein phosphate (that doesn't sound right now that I'm typing it, but that's all that's coming to mind...sorry) levels weren't good for them. She weights 351.7 (grams) and I've been giving her three at night and one in the morning every other day - LizardGirl had suggested 5 every other night, so it's close to what she was having before.

So basically, my baby will be okay.  
But can I have some opinions on the food/mealworm suggestions? She knew a lot about hedgehogs, but it seemed a bit off still.

Thank you everyone, so much for you're help and care! I am so glad I found this community to be apart of before I brought her home.


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## Stellara (Nov 12, 2011)

I would keep her on high quality cat food. My first hedgehog was on Pretty Pets, once I researched and compared ingredients, I'm pretty sure I came to the conclusion it was not sufficient (at least on its own)- this was awhile ago, so while I'm not sure what exactly I didn't like about it- I know I didn't like something.
I had to order the bags online and one of them ended up smelling bad- it had gone bad and I had fed my hedgehog a couple feedings that she got an upset stomach from.

Compare the ingredients, and I'm sure you will find (like I did) that it isn't up to par with a mix of high quality cat foods.

Many vets assume (rightly) that a cat shouldn't be fed a dogs food, a bird shouldn't be fed a hamsters food, etc. But with hedgehogs, I truly believe that after much research, high quality cat food is the way to go. As far as basic care, I do believe that those who have owned hedgehogs for decades know more than some vets who have met a hedgehog a few times and treated them. They don't get the chance to study hedgehog nutrition in vet school, and while I completely rely on much of what my vet says, I do not expect them to know everything- especially when it comes to diet of exotics, housing of exotics, etc. I DO think that mixing in some of the hedgehog specific foods is a good idea (especially the ones that are more insectivore diets) but there aren't any hedgehog foods on the market that I know about that are what I would classify as "good."- expecially on their own. After I went through the actual ingredients comparisons with my vet, she stopped telling people to use hedgehog specific diets and agrees with my (and many other's on here) choice of a mix of high quality cat foods. Had I not read about it on here, I would not have known to consider cat foods, but I truly believe my diet switch with my first girl, Zahara was one of the factors that allowed her to live a long life.


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## LarryT (May 12, 2009)

Glad she's going to be ok!


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

Stellara said:


> I would keep her on high quality cat food. My first hedgehog was on Pretty Pets, once I researched and compared ingredients, I'm pretty sure I came to the conclusion it was not sufficient (at least on its own)- this was awhile ago, so while I'm not sure what exactly I didn't like about it- I know I didn't like something.
> I had to order the bags online and one of them ended up smelling bad- it had gone bad and I had fed my hedgehog a couple feedings that she got an upset stomach from.
> 
> Compare the ingredients, and I'm sure you will find (like I did) that it isn't up to par with a mix of high quality cat foods.
> ...


That's what I thought - she started off on a hedgehog food (though it wasn't Pretty Pets) and she wouldn't eat and wasn't keeping weight well. As soon as I started giving her cat food, she was chowing down and is slowly working towards a more steady weight. I may look and see if I want to mix it in with the brands I have, but I did a lot of research and think what she has right now is sufficient enough. Thanks!



LarryT said:


> Glad she's going to be ok!


Me too!


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

Just noitced quite a bit of errors in that first message :roll: Guess that's what happens when you're excited to let people know what's going on


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## LizardGirl (Aug 25, 2008)

I'm glad the vet visit went well! I'm slightly concerned that the vet recommended against cat food and mealworms, and suggested one of the worst hedgehog foods in existence. But then, we rely on them for medical care like URIs and can just take their outdated care suggestions with a grain of salt. Which vet was this again? I feel like I told you about Dr. Burgess but I'm not gonna be too happy if he's the one that suggested that...


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

LizardGirl said:


> I'm glad the vet visit went well! I'm slightly concerned that the vet recommended against cat food and mealworms, and suggested one of the worst hedgehog foods in existence. But then, we rely on them for medical care like URIs and can just take their outdated care suggestions with a grain of salt. Which vet was this again? I feel like I told you about Dr. Burgess but I'm not gonna be too happy if he's the one that suggested that...


It seemed a bit off to me, so I'm glad to hear that! I plan on going as I had and ignoring that part of information she gave me.
No, it wasn't Dr. Burgess. I went to Beaverton Pet Clinic and I saw Dr. Ramsell - the website I found for her is Northwest Exotic Pet Vet (http://northwestexoticpetvet.com/).


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## jerseymike1126 (Jan 20, 2011)

glad to see she is ok


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## nualasmom (Nov 13, 2011)

YAY! I'm so excited that it turned out well. I know how long you've wanted a hedgie and then to finally get one home n have it get very sick would be sad. Nuala has been on Baytril twice and it seems to have worked out well. So hopefully Alaska will be back to herself soon.


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

nualasmom said:


> YAY! I'm so excited that it turned out well. I know how long you've wanted a hedgie and then to finally get one home n have it get very sick would be sad. Nuala has been on Baytril twice and it seems to have worked out well. So hopefully Alaska will be back to herself soon.


I was so upset! But I'm glad to know that she'll be better soon. I haven't given her any yet, how difficult is it to get them to take it?


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## nualasmom (Nov 13, 2011)

I really didn't have much problem giving it to Nuala. Although Nuala is a fair easy and social hedgie. I would hold her on my lap, in my right hand with her chin resting on my pointer finger to keep her head up. Then I would use the other hand to rub the syringe along her mouth until she opened it enough for me to get it inside. Then I'd slowly push the plunger to administer the medicine. Nuala seemed to be ok with the taste of Baytril so she would start licking it as I was giving it to her. Sometimes she would turn her head a few times to try to avoid getting it, but eventually she'd stop and I was able to get her to take the medicine.


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

nualasmom said:


> I really didn't have much problem giving it to Nuala. Although Nuala is a fair easy and social hedgie. I would hold her on my lap, in my right hand with her chin resting on my pointer finger to keep her head up. Then I would use the other hand to rub the syringe along her mouth until she opened it enough for me to get it inside. Then I'd slowly push the plunger to administer the medicine. Nuala seemed to be ok with the taste of Baytril so she would start licking it as I was giving it to her. Sometimes she would turn her head a few times to try to avoid getting it, but eventually she'd stop and I was able to get her to take the medicine.


She grabbed the plunger with her paws the second it touch her mouth and bit down on it til it was gone - and even then didn't want to give it back to me. :lol: I have a feeling she'll be just fine


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## jerseymike1126 (Jan 20, 2011)

i am assuming it is an oral med? it will be easy, its when you start having to inject meds it gets a bit tough (doubt u will ever need to do that!)


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

jerseymike1126 said:


> i am assuming it is an oral med? it will be easy, its when you start having to inject meds it gets a bit tough (doubt u will ever need to do that!)


Yep, just oral through a little plunger/syringe. She seems to like the taste, so it's pretty easy.


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## LarryT (May 12, 2009)

JackieMackk said:


> jerseymike1126 said:
> 
> 
> > i am assuming it is an oral med? it will be easy, its when you start having to inject meds it gets a bit tough (doubt u will ever need to do that!)
> ...


That is great!  Did the Vet flavor the meds for you?


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## Stellara (Nov 12, 2011)

jerseymike1126 said:


> i am assuming it is an oral med? it will be easy, its when you start having to inject meds it gets a bit tough (doubt u will ever need to do that!)


Agreed! Hedgies are definitely the hardest animal I have ever had to inject.

I'm glad she's taking her meds good- animals don't seem to mind the Baytril in comparison with other meds- most of the animal's I've given it to take the willingly


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## LizardGirl (Aug 25, 2008)

I'm glad she's doing good! Inky HATES oral meds and I have to scruff him and force him to take them, it's not very fun. Thank goodness she's cooperating for you.


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## LarryT (May 12, 2009)

LizardGirl said:


> I'm glad she's doing good! Inky HATES oral meds and I have to scruff him and force him to take them, it's not very fun. Thank goodness she's cooperating for you.


 No that feeling all to well lol! I usually have to go with a injected cricket! :roll:


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## JackieMackk (Nov 24, 2011)

> That is great!  Did the Vet flavor the meds for you?


Not to my knowledge, no. It doesn't have a particular smell, but I dont know if it smells different flavored or not so.


LizardGirl said:


> I'm glad she's doing good! Inky HATES oral meds and I have to scruff him and force him to take them, it's not very fun. Thank goodness she's cooperating for you.


Yeah, I'm so glad she likes it. Didnt want to have to figure out a way to force her!


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## jerseymike1126 (Jan 20, 2011)

i am pretty sure they add a flavor to it


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