# My hedgehog bit my other hedgehog



## Myloveforhedgehogs (Dec 4, 2012)

My friend and I where playing with my two hedgehogs and my female hedgehog went over to my male hedgehog and bit him. I was trying to keep them separate. My male hedgehog is not bleeding or anything. I am going to breed them soon hopefully. Do i still breed them if my female hedgehog bit him? Does any body know why she bit him? I have never put them to together before. I need a answer as soon as possable!


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## FiaSpice (Jan 16, 2009)

You said you're a new hedgehog owner, I would not try to breed that soon, I'd keep them totally separated. Are you hedgies related, do they have pedigree? Are you prepared to the ups and down of breeding? Do you have a mentor that can help you? 

Breeders might chime in with other question toughts.


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## Myloveforhedgehogs (Dec 4, 2012)

No my hedgehogs aren't related. No nether of them have a pedigree but i got them from two different people so they aren't related. Yes i am prepared for the ups and downs of breeding. I have read alot about hedgehogs and are getting two books online about hedgehogs. Yes i have a friend online that can help me. Thank you for your quick reply


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## tigereyes319 (Nov 10, 2012)

So you don't know if WHS runs in their lines. Just because you got them from two different people does not mean they are not related. Were they from breeders or friends who just happend to have a litter? If you did research you would know ovulation is caused by the male. The books may not have the most current information. Lizardgirl has a very informative care guide that you can download if you havent already. I have it saved on my desktop and refer to it often as well as this site. Are you prepared for the fact that she may not be a good mommie and you have to feed the babies? Or the fact she may eat them if disturbed? These are some of the things that I have had to face recently. I got lucky and my Shadow is a great mom so far. No I did not breed her. When I got her I didn't know until a week later she was pregnant until I heard little squeaks coming from her bin. The babies are now three weeks old and doing great from what I can tell. If it wasn't for the people on here I would have lost all of the babies.


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

I don't mean any offense, but breeding takes a ton of responsibility, time, money, and preparation. Do you have $1000 in case your female has complications with the birth? You said they don't have pedigrees - as tigereyes said, you don't know if they have WHS in their background. WHS is Wobbly Hedgehog Syndrome and it's horrible. Please, watch this video - 



 That is a hedgehog in the last stages of WHS. They are completely paralyzed, they can't move, and it's completely heartbreaking. It is not something that can be cured, or can be tested for. The only way you can know if your hedgehogs will pass it on is if you have the pedigrees and can check to see how their parents, grandparents, etc. died. It doesn't usually start until the hedgehog is at least a couple of years old - so you won't know until it's too late, and you have a bunch of babies who are all at risk for the same terrible fate. Please, read what we're saying and think better of what you're planning to do with your hedgehogs. Just enjoy them as pets - there is no reason to breed them. I also wrote a post that addresses a lot of issues with breeding - viewtopic.php?f=25&t=19339 Please, take the time to read it and consider those words. I hope you think better of your plans for your hedgehogs.


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## moxieberry (Nov 30, 2011)

If have to ask why she bit him, then you have a lot to learn, and you shouldn't be breeding.
If you don't have pedigrees for them, you shouldn't be breeding.
If you're under 18 (which it sounds like you are), you shouldn't be breeding.
If you're a "new owner" and haven't figured out the basics of hedgehog ownership and husbandry, including understanding how they're "wired" and why they do the things they do - you shouldn't be breeding.
If the majority (or all) of your information about hedgehogs comes from things you've read or books you've bought, you shouldn't be breeding.
If you don't understand what WHS is, and appreciate how serious it is, you shouldn't be breeding.
If you think getting two hedgehogs being from two different people/sources means they're guaranteed to not be related, you shouldn't be breeding.
If you think it's perfectly fine to put any male and female together, as long as they're "not related", you shouldn't be breeding.
If you haven't given any thought to the difference between "pet quality" and "breeding quality", you shouldn't be breeding.
If you don't have an experienced, reputable hedgehog breeder (not a BYB, not a friend who happened to breed two hedgehogs) available to act as your mentor, you shouldn't be breeding.
If you don't have a _considerable_ amount of money available for birth/pregnancy-related emergencies, you shouldn't be breeding.
If you don't have a vet nearby, who specializes in exotics and/or has an abundance of hedgehog experience, including breeding/pregnancy/birth/babies experience - you shouldn't be breeding.

If you're prepared for the "ups and downs", you will have no problem seeing these images:

:!: :!: WARNING/DISCLAIMER - GRAPHIC CONTENT :!: :!: 
I am trying to prove a point, and to anyone reading this, if you are not comfortable seeing dead babies, including blood and gore, DO NOT CLICK.

http://i.imgur.com/w0qm1.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/HcDoz.jpg

If you intend to breed, you will deal with dead babies. Babies die. It happens a lot. At least 1 in 4 hedgehog babies born does not survive. They might be whole, they might be bloody and half eaten, they might be simply devoured by the mother with no trace left. They might die in your hands when you want so badly to do something, anything, to keep them alive - but you're completely helpless. And every baby that dies is brought into the world because you chose to breed.

If you intend to breed, you will have vet costs. There are complications - they're more common than you'd think. Every time you breed, you're risking the life of the female. Breach babies. Hemorrhages. Infection. The list goes on.

Breeding is heartbreak. The only reason to breed is if there's something good to come of it. If you're improving the species, working on healthy lines, being careful and responsible, and being absolutely sure that the babies will lead full, happy, healthy lives.

Nothing about how you're going about this is going to benefit hedgehogs in any way - the species at large, or your hedgehogs specifically.

If you choose to breed your hedgehogs, you risk continuing genetic illness that other breeders - responsible and dedicated breeders - have worked so hard and so long to try to eradicate.
If you choose to breed, you risk the life of your female, who you claim to love.
If you choose to breed, you cannot guarantee the health and longevity of the babies, because you do not have sufficient knowledge of their bloodlines and genetic backgrounds.
If you choose to breed, you WILL have problems come up that you aren't prepared to deal with - or deal with the wrong way, to the detriment of the mother and babies - because you are not prepared. Because you don't have enough experience as a hedgehog owner. Because you don't have a mentor. Because you haven't given enough thought. Because you, by all appearances, are putting two hedgehogs together just for the fun of it, without any idea of what you're really getting into.

If your username ("myloveforhedgehogs") is genuine and true, please do not breed your hedgehogs.


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

Wonderful post Moxie.  

The two links Moxie provided are a very mild representation of what dead babies can look like. Not to mention what can happen to mom. Having a mom with a baby stuck half way out, or watching mom bleed out and die knowing the only reason she is dead is because YOU chose to breed her. Breeding is not for the squeamish, the easily upset, or for those without a good all round knowledge base. It's also not for those with limited finances or those dependent on parents or others to provide transportation to the vet.


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## tigereyes319 (Nov 10, 2012)

You may think Moxie and Nancy were brutal but it is because they want what is best for the hedgies. But I agree 100% with them. Breeding is not for fun or profit. It can be nothing but heartache and alot of sleepless nights. Also having homes for the babies if they survive is important also. These people need to know how to take care of them properly including what foods they need. Also pulling your information from youtube is not the best way to learn since a lot of it is wrong ie handling babies just born.


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## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

You have been given some wonderful advice I hope for the sake of your hedgies that you will take the advice and keep them completely seperated from now on.


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## Shell (Aug 23, 2012)

OMG! Should have read the photo warning first. Nightmare city. 
Please, if those photo's don't stop you from breeding, I don't know what will. Please do your research. All the posts above are the reality of breeding. Please just love your hedgy. Don't breed and risk the health of your pet. It's just not worth it. I truely hope you think twice.


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## tigereyes319 (Nov 10, 2012)

I did read the warning! I dont like gruesome stuff so I didnt look. I wonder if we have frightened the OP off with our posts. Hope not since they definatley need information on how to care for their hedgies. Hopefully they understand the passion and love for the hedgies is why we are telling them not to breed. If not I do hope everything works out for the hedgehogs and they arent bred.


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## FiaSpice (Jan 16, 2009)

Moxie, great extensive post I didn't tought of everything you said on top of my head, well said. Those are most of the argument I told my ex when he wtought it would be bice (back then) to breed Litchi. It's not just about having cute babies.


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

Someone who is planning to breed needs to have maturity and be not only responsible in actions, but be self sufficient enough to be able to provide whatever the pregnant mom and new babies will need. Part of maturity and being responsible is being able to accept advice and criticism and ultimately doing what is in the best interests of the animals. Sometimes that means putting off breeding for a few years until it can be done properly. 

Sadly we see too often someone who is so desperate for their pet to have babies that they put their own selfish wants above the health and welfare of the animal. All too frequently there will be a so called "accidental" mating that nobody ever believes is an accident. 

Hopefully, the OP will be responsible and listen to the advice given and take the time to learn about hedgehogs first, and in time start the process to become a responsible breeder whom people will respect.


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## JulieAnne (Sep 3, 2012)

The OP can look at it this way... now she has a stepping stone on what to start learning to begin gaining enough knowledge to become a future breeder. 

I would love to be able to breed my Prim but I know I am not financially, or emotionally, ready for that. Nor do I have nearly enough knowledge about hedgehogs/breeding. I shall leave it to the experts and just look at their adorable baby pictures when they post them .

I sincerely hope the OP saw Moxie and Nancy's posts as them showing concern for the well being of the hedgehogs and for the OP's well being too. There's nothing wrong with coming off a little strong when there are serious life or death matters to address.

I hope the OP is able to breed some time in the future though. In the mean time I hope your hedgies leg is ok!


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## JulieAnne (Sep 3, 2012)

Also, in answer to the OP's "why" question. I'm by no means an expert and I'm sure there could be a number of reasons why your hedgie bit your other hedgie but my first reason would be... hedgehogs are pretty territorial little critters. That is why everyone says to keep them separate. I've heard a few horror stories of hedgies killing each other when they were in the same space. 

Someone please correct me if I'm mistaken.


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## The hedgehog (Dec 5, 2012)

Wow....... i cannot express how disappointed i am in the responses to this questions.

The girl who posted this question is my younger sister- she came to me very depressed about your responses to her question. Don't go calling her out just because of her age! Age and knowledge are often weighed on the same scale. I have seen how much she has researched these critters, she knows *alot* more than you think. Just because she asks a simple question, you all quickly and harshly jump to the conclusion that she is not capable of breeding hedgehogs!!! And only ONE of you has provided an answer to her quetion- the rest of you take the time to tear her down and discourage her instead of answering her question. You all have had a start in breeding hedgehogs, and i'm sure you didn't have anyone critisizing you- there is a start for everything, and just because she isn't "mature" in no way means she cannot handle the responsibility of caring for the hedgehogs and breeding them. It says in registstration "young user friendly".... i laugh at that. It would do alot more good for you to encourage her instead of spending your time tearing her down. Say bad things about me, but i have done my part in standing up for my sister.


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## JulieAnne (Sep 3, 2012)

I understand that you want to protect your little sister and yes the answers were harsh but they were harsh for a reason. A lot of people jump into breeding far too soon and hedgehogs suffer because of that. Everyone here is looking out for the hedgehogs best interest and in doing so they want to make sure people comprehend the severity and reality of the situation they are walking in to. 

I'm sure your sister is mature for her age and I don't know how old she is, except for young, but I wouldn't want my child to take on the responsibility and heartache.


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## LizardGirl (Aug 25, 2008)

> It would do alot more good for you to encourage her instead of spending your time tearing her down.


So we should encourage her to breed hedgehogs that are not contributing in a positive manner to the species whatsoever, and that may end up passing on fatal genetic diseases that other breeders are trying so hard to eradicate? We should encourage her to breed a species that she doesn't have a good understanding of based on her lack of experience (you can have as much knowledge as you want, but experiencing it is totally different) and would be highly unlikely to know what to do in the event of the many different emergencies that accompany breeding? We should encourage her to produce animals to sell to other people despite the fact that she won't be able to properly educate the new owners due to her lack of experience? GOOD breeders wait until they have the experience, knowledge, resources, stability, and maturity to do so. Your sister does not fit that category. She wants to breed hedgehogs to have cute babies and maybe make some money on the side. If you're not trying to improve the species, you're not doing hedgehogs as a whole, a favor. Only a selfish, irresponsible person would put their own wants above that. That's the truth, not sugar coated for a young person's ears - if a person wants to breed they should be able to be talked to like an adult, not a child. We're trying to emphasize the extremely important reasons that she should not be breeding, and especially not hedgehogs with unknown lineage. If she can't take those warnings seriously, she is absolutely not fit to be producing more animals.


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## tigereyes319 (Nov 10, 2012)

It wasnt a teardown as you put it. It was to inform her of some of the dangers of breeding hedgehogs with no pedigrees. The information that Moxie and Nancy put out came from years of breeding and trying to better the breed. And Im sure heartache also when things did not go so well. Sometimes the brutal truth is better than sugarcoating it. I hope she does stay on the site to research more as there is a ton of correct information on here.


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## SouthernSweet (Jul 25, 2012)

o.o eek. This site is an excellent resource, and what the breeders here are saying is all true.

Your sister is welcome to come to this site to use it as a resource, but asking people to support unethical breeding is not realistic. It is the sort of thing that needs to be pointed out.

Also, if this is the sort of thing that makes your sister truly depressed, she may need to learn some coping skills. Depression is not a proper reaction to easily corrected mistakes.

Otherwise, all kids get upset/embarrassed when this sort of thing happens, and I'm sorry that the responses upset her so much. But she should know that everyone here has her and her hedgies' best interests at heart and would love to have her here to learn.


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## moxieberry (Nov 30, 2011)

Hello, The hedgehog. 

If you think that we responded the way we did "just because of her age", I suggest that you reread the replies more carefully. This isn't about her being "too young" to be responsible - it's about her simply NOT being responsible. If a person of the same age came onto this forum intending to breed hedgehogs after having owned them for a year or two, having pedigreed animals, having a qualified mentor, and having a plan in place to address the many difficulties of proper, responsible breeding, that person would have gotten a difference reception.

Yes, the age is a factor - not because someone under 18 isn't capable, but because to do the best you can for the hedgehogs, you need access to finances, etc, that younger people simply don't have. You need to be independent and self-sufficient to support the hedgehogs in the correct way, to be able to get them treatment when needed no matter the financial cost, and to not be dependent on a parent to get a trip to the vet or to pay those expenses. But age is ONE factor out of many.

Your sister demonstrated that she does not have the experience or the understanding of various important factors of breeding, such as genetic illness and the importance of pedigrees. She demonstrated a lack of foresight. She was advised to not pursue breeding as a new owner. She was asked if they are related, if they have pedigrees, and if she is prepared for the problems of breeding - and her answers demonstrated a lack of true understanding of this subject, and a lack of correct preparation.

If she chooses to breed hedgehogs without pedigree, she is being irresponsible. And that's not because of her age. I would say the same thing about ANY person choosing to breed un-pedigreed hedgehogs. That's to say nothing of the other things I mentioned in my first post.

Bluntness is sometimes necessary to get the point across. To be blunt again - if she cannot handle being criticized on a forum about her unethical choices concerning breeding animals, she probably cannot handle the heartbreak of breeding anyway.

This forum is full of people, including excellent breeders, who would be happy to give your sister guidance. First, in terms of ownership. Then, when she's had some experience simply having hedgehogs as pets, and is in a position in her life to be able to handle the responsibility (which has to do with financial resources, a driver's license, etc, and NOT in terms of maturity), this forum would be a great resource to help her do that in the correct way.

The way she intends to do it, as demonstrated by her first two posts, is NOT correct and will NOT be supported here. And, to be blunt again - if you choose to support it, because she's your sister, without considering the damage that she could be doing by breeding irresponsibly, you are being irresponsible as well.

We don't judge people (breeders or otherwise) based on their age, but based on their actions. Based on the decisions they make. Breeding two un-pedigreed hedgehogs is a CHOICE. If she makes that choice, having now been warned against it, that's up to her. If she is truly as mature and responsible as you believe she is, then she won't breed them. It's that simple.


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## SpiritWolves1 (Apr 5, 2012)

i agree with everyone on this form. Sorry The Hedgehog, but its harsh, ive had much harsher opinions on breeding, and i do not think that after my experience with Shade ( my female who is due for birth on the 17 of this month) how scary it is, how absolutely terrifying it is to think she could die at any moment during birth, i do not think i will ever breed. her breeding was an accident. think how bad your sister would feel if your sister bred them and the female died. did you know that is momma dies die, hand feeding every 2 hours is required, if you even find live babies? did you know that almost no babies that are hand fed make it? think about it, breeding isnt a good think for young people, its way to stressful, painful and just by her post, she does not know enough at all to even think about breeding. sorry if this seems harsh, but its thr truth, ive cried myself to sleep thinking that Shade might die, close to christmas, she could die, be gone forever and you cant change that, ive had nightmares, of her dying and me having to stand and watch, not being able to do anything. im 15. im young. its not fun. have your sister message me if youd like.


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## The hedgehog (Dec 5, 2012)

I have read what you all have to say. I don't have a problem with you guys not "sugarcoating", but thats no excuse for the way you conducted yourselves. I do agree with whoever said that you should do what is right to improve the species, and for the wellbeing of the animal. I also think that she needs a little more experience with the hedgehogs prior to breeding them. What got me on edge was how you jumped to conclusions so quickly about her knowlegde and responsibility for animals, i mean, she is a new member to the "fourm world" and may not know how to express her thoughts as well online, she didn't get much time to "prove" herself and build a reputation on how knowledgeable she is. Hopefully she stays on this forum to learn as much as she can, then decide if she still wants to breed or not.


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## SouthernSweet (Jul 25, 2012)

We'd love for her to stay and learn!  

I'm glad she has done research, many people do not do as much. The concern is the source of the information she has, because the knowledge she has presented is worrying.

Could she share with us her resources? Such as books, etc? Perhaps we can suggest useful reading material! I know that breeders from this forum publish good info to the web on their websites and in PDF form that can be read on her computer like a book.


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## moxieberry (Nov 30, 2011)

I hope she stays as well. We're happy to have more hedgehog lovers here who are willing to learn and are committed to the good, responsible care of hedgehogs. 

I, and the others who replied, were going on what information was available. She may have a vast amount of knowledge about general hedgehog care and hedgehogs as pets; however, from her mention of being a new owner, as well as her apparent sources for knowledge, most likely she does have some things to learn. That's not a bad thing! Basically everyone who comes onto this forum has something to learn about hedgehogs, to whatever extent. What it does mean, however, is that she's not a good fit for breeding.

In terms of being responsible, I can't make any comment about how responsible she is with other animals. My comments were driven by her apparent determination to breed two hedgehogs without pedigrees and without seeming to have a strong base of general knowledge to start with - either because she was unaware of the things she should be taking into consideration, or because she doesn't care. Unfortunately, given her second reply after some of those things were brought to her attention, it did seem like she doesn't (or didn't) care. Hopefully that isn't the case, but that's all I or anyone else had to go on.

When it appears that someone is going to breed when they're either uninformed or just don't care enough to make sure they're doing it the right way, this community is not one that sits by and lets that pass without making its opinion known. I, for one, will never value a person's feelings over the welfare of hedgehogs.

If myloveforhedgehogs wants to stay and learn from this community, and make decisions focused on the well-being of her hedgehogs and hedgehogs at large, we would be more than happy to have her. 

My own website, and the PDF care book by LizardGirl, are great places to start. These are completely update and accurate sources for current hedgehog information. The general consensus here is that any other care books you might find in stores, etc, are not as up to date or accurate.

http://www.volcanoviewhedgehogs.com/hedgehog-care.html
http://www.westcoasthedgehogs.com/files ... nload.html


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## SouthernSweet (Jul 25, 2012)

> http://www.volcanoviewhedgehogs.com/hedgehog-care.html
> http://www.westcoasthedgehogs.com/files ... nload.html


These are exactly the good publications I was thinking of


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## moxieberry (Nov 30, 2011)

SouthernSweet said:


> These are exactly the good publications I was thinking of




I like to think of mine as sort of a condensed, abridged version of LG's. It's designed to be read through quickly to get the overall gist. I totally would have written a book-length guide (I'm a writer at heart!) but she beat me to it! I recommend LG's book to everyone who inquires about our babies.


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## tigereyes319 (Nov 10, 2012)

The adult mature responsible thing for her to do would be for her to come back on the fourm talk with us and not have you doing it for her. No attacks just simple talking and exchanging information. As has been stated the welfare of the hedgies comes before being nice. There is a reason for the saying I like my animals better than humans. Humans can take care of themselves but it is up to us to provide the best care possible for them.


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## HappyHedgies (Feb 17, 2011)

Having baby hedgehogs running around seems cute and exciting but it takes a lot out of a person. I honestly dont think anyone can fully prepare themselves for the heartache associated with breeding hedgehogs. It never gets easy seeing dead babies and its very heard on the heart. Spending countless hours handfeeding litters that were rejected is very time consuming, VERY draining and it really takes a tole on the people involved. I have had to hand feed a few litters and its no walk in the park. Its very difficult especially when you spend countless nights trying to help a baby survive and it dying in the end. 

There is so much more to it then putting a male and female together and making babies. You need to make sure the animals you plan to breed are genetically healthy. You also cannot guarantee that the animals are not related because you got them from two different people. You would be surprised how closely related some hedgehogs are and they can come from different parts of your country. It is not healthy, proper or right to breed hedgehogs without a clear genetic history. If you breed without this your pretty much flying blind and creating babies that could wind up very sick in the future. This is very irresponsible and no one will support it. 

When you go the extra step to get pedigreed hedgehogs and breed them properly its so much more rewarding. When you see the hoglets for the first time and know they are strong, healthy animals it's a certain kind of satisfaction and pride that you can't get anywhere else. Hedgehog breeding should come with a warning sign because once you have your lineage going and you breed really healthy animals all you want to do is create a hoglet better then the last. Im very proud of all the babies I produce because I know what im creating and im ultimately helping out the hedgehog species as a whole by creating strong, healthy animals. When people BYB they are effecting our work and hard efforts. People who breed for the love of the animal are all working towards one goal, to reduce the risk of WHS among hedgehogs and weed out other diseases that can be passed on genetically. Wouldn't your sister want to be apart of this as well instead of working against us?

We want her to stay, we want her to learn. Yes everyone has to start out somewhere which is completely fine but why not start off in the right place? We are more then willing to give advice and support as long as she is making ethical, proper decisions with her hedgehogs. She doesn't have to become a big time breeder but every proper decision counts and matters to the species. Everyone who participates in BYB are frowned upon because they are effecting the animals we love and are so passionate about. 

People may come across as harsh here but it is the truth and if people are not able to handle it then they should not be breeding because you will face things worse then the words on here when it comes to breeding. 

One bad breeding experience of mine would be with my Willow. With her last litter she ended up having a stroke. She started off with 4 hoglets, one died within the first 3 days but the others were strong and thriving. Despite the stroke she tried to care for them to the best of her abilities. The 3 remaining babies made it to 3.5 weeks without incident. Their eyes were open, had fur all over their bodies. We thought we were in the clear but Willow became distressed. She carried one of her hoglets around through the night. When we checked on her this morning we seen the hoglet outside of her nest, head missing and completely crushed. We think while carrying the baby Willow may have injured her and after the injury she killed her. It was really sad to see a hoglet this old and have it pass away. The other two babies made it without issue but I cant get that image out of my mind seeing the hoglet like that. 

Willow has made a nearly full recovery from the stroke, since then we have not used her for breeding because we dont want to take a chance putting her in danger again. Every single time you breed a hedgehog the females life can be lost. So much can go wrong, ask any breeder im sure they all have their stories. This is why its also important you have a mentor before you plan to breed for someone to help you along through the difficult times. Sometimes peoples experience is the only answer to some situations.


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

I don't have too much to add, since everyone else has said what I was thinking and more. But I just want to add in another opinion that I hope she does stick around and continue sharing with the forum and learning from it. Our intent is never to drive anyone away - we just feel very strongly regarding the welfare of hedgehogs, and that tends to get us immediately on the alert when any new owner (no matter the age) talks about breeding their hedgehogs, especially ones that are not pedigreed. We are very defensive of hedgehogs in general, and the health of individual hedgehogs and of the species as a whole. We don't mean any harm - we're just very definite about our feelings on these things! I hope your sister realizes that we weren't trying to hurt her feelings - only explain why breeding would be a very bad idea, and why it'd be best if she enjoyed her hedgehogs just as pets for now. We'd love to have her back!


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

Age has nothing to do with knowledge level or in many cases, maturity. We see lots of adults that have no knowledge, don't want to learn, and take no responsibility for the pets in their care.

What is an issue with children and teenagers is that they are dependent on parents/guardians. The young person might be very knowledgeable, responsible and know the right thing to do but are at the mercy of their parents for housing, finances and transportation. Unless the parents are 100% on board with the child/teen breeding and is willing to provide what could be $1000 or more for an emergency spay, plus transportation possibly in the middle of the night, or have to leave work to take hedgie to the vet, then it won't work. With a knowledgeable willing to follow advice child/teen and supportive parents, it can work. Most of the time, it doesn't. We've seen it happen too many times that the child/teen knows hedgie needs to see the vet but hasn't got enough money or way to get there and the parents who were on board with getting the pet, suddenly decide they aren't willing to pay for what is needed. 

We've also seen not only children and teens, but adults too, get a hedgehog or two and are all enthusiastic and learning as much as possible but then the thrill wears off or they realize just how much time and money is involved and 6 months later, hedgie is being rehomed. We've even seen this happen and the female is pregnant and being rehomed anyways. 

We see people who say they have done loads of research and are knowledgeable but by their questions, it's obvious they don't really know that much and this was the case here. Sometimes people don't know enough to even realize how much they don't know, and this has nothing to do with age.


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## FiaSpice (Jan 16, 2009)

Nancy said:


> Age has nothing to do with knowledge level or in many cases, maturity. We see lots of adults that have no knowledge, don't want to learn, and take no responsibility for the pets in their care.
> 
> What is an issue with children and teenagers is that they are dependent on parents/guardians. The young person might be very knowledgeable, responsible and know the right thing to do but are at the mercy of their parents for housing, finances and transportation. Unless the parents are 100% on board with the child/teen breeding and is willing to provide what could be $1000 or more for an emergency spay, plus transportation possibly in the middle of the night, or have to leave work to take hedgie to the vet, then it won't work. With a knowledgeable willing to follow advice child/teen and supportive parents, it can work. Most of the time, it doesn't. We've seen it happen too many times that the child/teen knows hedgie needs to see the vet but hasn't got enough money or way to get there and the parents who were on board with getting the pet, suddenly decide they aren't willing to pay for what is needed. ...


You are right on this one. I, and I'm sure you did too, saw some younger member here (or or CnQ/CnH) saying how their hedgie needed medical attentention but their parent wouldn't drive them, help them pay or simply up the temperature of the room for a sick hedgie.


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## Sunshiner (May 12, 2010)

Just wanted to make a quick post on WHS. My hedgehog, Pixel, died a month ago. I believe the cause was WHS. It was very quick. A week and a half before I noticed she had lost a lot of weight, she was an avid runner and at constantly. She was always on the small side, and dropped from .80 lbs to .30 lbs. It was horrid. By the time I noticed something was up, she couldn't eat on her own. I syringe fed her for days, gave her water, and she became increasingly immobilized. By the end, she couldn't even stand up. DO NOT breed your hedgehogs unless you know for sure that they have no WHS in their family.


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## HappyHedgies (Feb 17, 2011)

I reciently took a hedgehog into my care. The owner was a young girl who could not afford vet care. You can see the thread here: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=20792&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=20

Unfortunately this is what can happen if you are not financially stable. Even though the harm done to this hedgehog was not from breeding this is what can happen when you don't have a stable income. Thankfully this guy, Bennett is doing much much better but he still should not of suffered the way he has. He should of been treated eight away but the owner couldnt afford it or get him there. He is a pet store hedgehog so hopefully he doesn't come up with any serious issues later down the road.

You need to be prepared for emergencies when you own hedgehogs because anything can happen. They can be really sensitive animals. It's important to have energency funds stored away just in case something does come up. More so for breeding because a lot can happen. Lives can easily be lost and they can be really expensive to fix. It's something to consider before you breed.


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## prickleypair (Jul 9, 2013)

As a note- the original number of hedgehogs brought into this country was very few and the gene pool is fairly small. And with WHS becomeing more widespread, it is becoming more and more obvious that this is a genetic trait that all hedgehogs carry. A pedigree means NOTHING. It's like telling a person they shouldn't have a baby because a relative had Downs Syndrome or a club foot. Seriously. If a young person takes the time to ask those who are supposed to be there to kindly correct and teach then we need to respond with tact. Otherwise when yall are dead and gone, who will be left to raise the next generation of hedgies. After all, who gave you permission to breed? Who taught you? Seriously.


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## Annie&Tibbers (Apr 16, 2013)

Psst. You just revived a thread that was last posted in in December 2012. By now, the original poster has either reformed or bred.


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## grins&needles (Sep 10, 2013)

Bottom line. No pedigree. No breeding. Even someone totally prepared to breed would need a different pair that has pedigrees.

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## MomLady (Aug 14, 2010)

Another thought, NO ONE should be breeding before they have had at least one hedgehog that has lived with them for their entire life, from weaning until the hedgie crosses the rainbow bridge. 
How would you know if you WANT to breed an animal you have never experienced for its entire life cycle?
When someone has had their hedgie for a few months and wants to breed, it raises a RED flag.

Just my two cents. 

ML


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