# Herc is sick....again. Suggestions?



## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

Hi guys,

As many of you know Herc's respiratory health has been an ongoing battle with us. No matter what we do every 2 months or so he gets sneezy. The vet has put it down to severe allergies. I've switched him onto fleece liners, try to keep the dust down in his room, use dye and perfume free detergent for his liners. He is now sick again, and I just feel really frustrated that it's something I may or may not be doing that's causing this. Last week he was clearly struggling to breathe. He only ate a few kibbles a night, and started doing a really slow walk on his wheel (I know...he's obsessed with that wheel. Even when he's sick he has to go on it). His breathing sounded whistly, so we went to the vet last wednesday. She did a slide off of a sneeze he did, and she said it looked like a sheet of white blood cells with blood mixed in, indicating a severe infection. She gave him 2 weeks of baytril, then said he will likely be on baby benadryl for the rest of his life. He also got carnivore care as he wasn't eating a lot. He has been on the baytril for almost a week now, and almost immediately his breathing sounded much better. He started eating his dinner and wheeling like normal. But last night the sneezing came back, and pretty fierce too. His breathing sounds ok, but the sneezing is every few minutes, especially while he's running or being active. I phoned the vet back, she said to continue with the baytril and also give him baby benadryl, and if there is no improvement by thursday to call her back and we will switch to a different antibiotic. 

Sorry to ramble guys, but I'm feeling super frustrated. Does anyone have any ideas of things I could do to improve his health, or have any experiences like this? Thanks in advance for any suggestions.


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## Kalandra (Aug 25, 2008)

Have you had a culture & sensitivity done? I cannot remember if you have or not, and am being lazy and don't feel like searching...


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## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

No, but I think that will probably be the next step. The vet said this morning if he isn't improved by thursday we're going to switch to another antibiotic.


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## Kalandra (Aug 25, 2008)

I'd have a culture done before starting a new antibiotic. At least then you will know if the problem is bacterial and what will kill it. If the culture doesn't grow then you won't be treating your hedgehog with antibiotics for no reason and can concentrate on other possible issues (allergies, etc).


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## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

Kalandra said:


> I'd have a culture done before starting a new antibiotic. At least then you will know if the problem is bacterial and what will kill it. If the culture doesn't grow then you won't be treating your hedgehog with antibiotics for no reason and can concentrate on other possible issues (allergies, etc).


Thanks Kalandra. Do you know if that's expensive? I hate to ask, because I know if he needs it he needs it, but my emerg fund is pretty much done with all Herc's vet visits.


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## fracturedcircle (May 31, 2010)

poor Herc, i was wondering about him just the other day.  

re the culture: i really don't remember, but i think it's about $100-150? Kalandra, does this sound right?


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## Kalandra (Aug 25, 2008)

Under $150 should be right. The last one we had run was just under $130. They are not horribly expensive when it comes to tests. And it can save you money in the long run. Instead of trying various antibiotics and other medications and repeated veterinary visit costs, you will learn which one works best. No guessing games. And your hedgehog will not be sick for as long (the biggest benefit!).

Ask your vet what he charges though. The cost does vary a lot depending on the lab they send it off to. And occasionally the clinic may do them in house. I had a vet that did them in house for about 1/2 the cost.


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## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

Thanks guys!


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## KathyTNY (Jan 21, 2011)

((((((((HUGS))))))))))) to you! That is all that I can offer you - I can only imagine how frustrating and anxious I would be if I were in your shoes! Can't offer any help, just a hug and a prayer!

Kathy


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## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

KathyTNY said:


> ((((((((HUGS))))))))))) to you! That is all that I can offer you - I can only imagine how frustrating and anxious I would be if I were in your shoes! Can't offer any help, just a hug and a prayer!
> 
> Kathy


Thank you, that helps too! 

So, I don't mean to sound dumb here, but last year when Herc was sick the vet took a slide off some of his nasal discharge and sent it to the lab to see what it was. It came back as e-coli. Is that a different test from the culture?


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## rivoli256 (Mar 1, 2009)

another person with no real help but tons of hugs & good thoughts...& a *dang it, get better, Herc!*

i am so sorry he feels awful & i know you do too...


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## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

rivoli256 said:


> another person with no real help but tons of hugs & good thoughts...& a *dang it, get better, Herc!*
> 
> i am so sorry he feels awful & i know you do too...


Thank you!


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## Kalandra (Aug 25, 2008)

You may want to ask your vet if they did a c/s last time. However, I would have expected your vet to take a swab and put it in a vial rather than on a slide.

I don't know how much you know about the procedure, but in case it helps anyone else the following link has a pretty good explanation of how a culture is grown and how it is helpful http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm ... 73&aid=993


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## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

That article really does explain it well. I'll ask the vet about that one. Thanks!


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## PJM (May 7, 2010)

I hope you can figure out what's wrong with the little guy. I hate that you both keep having to go through this.


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## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

Me too PJ. It's super frustrating.


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## Immortalia (Jan 24, 2009)

Awww  this sucks. Poor little guy, sending good thoughts your way!

Do you have an air purifier? Could it be something in the air? Since you've done just about everything else, save for putting him into his own little life bubble. And another thing would be to take him off kibbles and try fresh food only? Just throwing random stuff out there.


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## fracturedcircle (May 31, 2010)

Katie--i also suggest posting this on the Hedgehog Welfare Society mail-list: http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/hedgehogwelfare/

there are many experienced folks on there. someone might've had a similar issue.


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## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

Immortalia said:


> Do you have an air purifier? Could it be something in the air? Since you've done just about everything else, save for putting him into his own little life bubble. And another thing would be to take him off kibbles and try fresh food only? Just throwing random stuff out there.


I got him an air purifier last time he got sick. He won't touch any kind of fresh food, except for mealies. I'm also really hesitant to try new foods with him in case it is allergies and he has a bad reaction.



fracturedcircle said:


> Katie--i also suggest posting this on the Hedgehog Welfare Society mail-list: http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/hedgehogwelfare/


I just went on there and requested to join, thanks for the tip!

Thanks for the advice and support too everyone!


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

I would get the culture and sensitivity done as Kalandra has suggested. I think the fact that they are finding bacteria on the swabs and did find e-coli, it sounds to me like he is never getting fully cured. 

I've had a couple with allergies and they sneeze and snort and snuffle and soak me when they sneeze (clear fluid), but they don't loose their appetite. If it does prove to be allergies and if allergies are cumulative in hedgehogs like they are in humans, it may not be just one thing he is allergic to. He may be bothered by numerous things but doesn't have a reaction unless 2 or more are present at the same time. 

If he was allergic to one of his foods, he would have the reaction all the time, unless, something else is factoring into it. Also, baytril is not going to get rid of an allergy. 

I really don't know what to suggest other than the culture and sensitivity but I don't think you can do that now that he is on antibiotic because I believe that affects the results. 

Sending prayers for the poor little guy.


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## Kalandra (Aug 25, 2008)

It is usually recommended to remove the antibiotic for about a week to ensure a good result is seen.


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## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

Thanks all.

I have to phone the vet tomorrow morning anyways to give her an update, so I will talk to her about the c & s. 

I would swear if Herc was a human he would have exercised induced asthma. I took him out last night for a foot bath and cuddle time. He was out for close to 2 hours, and he snuggled into my chest, not sneezing at all. He didn't sneeze in the footbath either. I took everything out of his cage and cleaned the cage,wheel, and pigloo with vinegar and water, then rinsing them off so they don't smell like vinegar. I gave him a newly washed liner and pigloo blankie, even a brand new tp tube. His stuffed animals were washed last week, with the same perfume free dye free detergent as the liner and blankie. Within about half an hour of running on his wheel he was sneezing. It seems like most of his appetite is back too. Unfortunately, so are the baytril green poops. I know it's weird to say, but it seems to be brought on by exercise, especially on the wheel. Maybe it's the room I keep him on? Who knows.


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## Kalandra (Aug 25, 2008)

Something to think about if you want to look for allergens...

Is there a plant in the room? I ask because I had a discussion once with someone who thought they were allergic to their hedgehog and were going to rehome the hedgehog. They actually found out there was a plant in the room whose pot had mold growing in it. Her allergy was caused by the hedgehog only in that she sat in that room, near that potted plant when holding the hedgehog.

Maybe there is something in his area that could be causing it?


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## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

I've thought of that one too Kalandra. No plants in the room, but the carpet is a dust magnet. Maybe a dust allergy?


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## MissC (Nov 15, 2010)

I was just going to say maybe the carpet...? Ours is SO bad. We have some kind of super-sonic uber vac and no other pets ('cept fish :lol: ) but Jamie can tell if I haven't vacuumed within last 2-3 days - his allergies go crazy. 

Snarf doesn't seem to have an issue with it - he only ever sneezes when he first wakes up. So no help there, I'm afraid... :? 

Can you switch him to a different room for a week or so...be interesting to see...or come visit me with Herc for a week!!! (I will vacuum first.)


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## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

I love it! I know I could totally use a vacation. :lol:


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## hercsmom (Jul 6, 2010)

I have an update for you all:

I just got off the phone with Herc's vet. My boy didn't have a good night last night. He was struggling to breathe, and when I took him out of his cage he had snot smeared all down his cheek. When we had cuddle time he blew a couple of nose bubbles. We have an appointment for tomorrow morning to have a culture and sensitivity done. She is also going to add clindamycin to the baytril until we get the results back next week. Then, depending on the results, she may gas him and give him an x-ray. I'm really hoping that he has just developed resistance to the baytril and it's not something more serious like pneumonia or a tumor. I know there's nothing I can do until I see the vet, but I'm so worried about my kid. I'll let you all know tomorrow what the vet says. Thanks for the support everyone


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## PJM (May 7, 2010)

Poor, sweet Herc! I really hope you can get to the bottom of this. I can't imagine not feeling good for so long.


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