# Do they have to eat insects



## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

So when I was looking into getting a hedgehog, the person I was talking to said that I dont have to feed them any insects. The breeder we brought my hedgehog from also said that insects arent a good idea to feed them, though she didnt really know much and was against feeding her anything but the dry cat food that wasnt even good them. 
Looking at lot of these posts, everyone seems to suggest giving them insects. 
My vet asked if she had any insects, and I said no, because the breeder obviously hadnt given her any, and I havent given her any either.
Now I want to know if I have to give her things like mealworms and other insects because I dont know if this would really be possible. 
She hasnt had anything but dry food her whole life. I am in the process of changing over her food to something a lot better for her.

Anyways do I really have to feed her insects, or would she be okay without them ??
She has never had any insects in her 4 months and a bit of her life.


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## Draenog (Feb 27, 2012)

Yes they need insects, preferably daily or at least several times a week and as wide a variety as possible. Live is preferred. The best feeders are dubia roaches and black soldier fly larvae (based on their nutritional value) but mealworms, superworms, crickets, grasshoppers, locusts etc. can be used too.

Unfortunately there are still people who think hedgehogs can do without insects. Will they die without them? Likely not, but insects have a lot of health benefits and consider this: invertebrates are their primary food source in the wild. The vast majority of what they eat is invertebrates. How can it be okay not to feed them this if it's actually the main thing they are supposed to eat?

I would steer away from any breeder who thinks it's okay to deprive them of insects. That's too late for you now, but it isn't too late to introduce insects to her diet. You can put them in her bowl and leave them there for the night if she doesn't take them straight from your hand or tweezers (sometimes it takes a while for them to eat them if they aren't used to it, just keep trying they eventually will).

If you want to read more about the importance of (live) invertebrates I recommend reading this: http://hedgehogsofasgard.com/post/164150669251/hedgehog-nutrition


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

Okay thank you so much, will have a read and will have to look into getting some insects for her. 
I wasnt sure I thought they might but I was told by two people who breed their hedgehogs that they dont need them.
Although the first one did feed hers dried meal worms twice a week, but said they shouldnt be part of their main diet due to being very fatty.
And the breeder that I brought my hedgehog from was against its completely.


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

Would dried meal worms be okay with something else as live.
I live with my mum, and she doesnt really want live worms in her house anywhere. And even dried meal worms are a bit of a push.

I really want the best for Holly but I cant really annoy my mum specially as its her house and all.


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## Veebs84 (Sep 6, 2018)

Look on amazon - you can get all sorts of dried insects - mealworms ad crickets etc. Mealworms are good and what my previous boy had. I'm planning to give Marjorie a variety but mostly freeze dried - pets at home sell if thats helps - because i don't get through the fresh ones fast enough! I had a box of meal worms that mutated into beatles that put me right off! On reflection, they were 'too old' when i bought them but quite alarming!!! 

Wilko also sell dry mealworms in pet section


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## HockeyHedgehog (May 20, 2018)

Ria said:


> Would dried meal worms be okay with something else as live.
> I live with my mum, and she doesnt really want live worms in her house anywhere. And even dried meal worms are a bit of a push.
> 
> I really want the best for Holly but I cant really annoy my mum specially as its her house and all.


Dried insects aren't ideal for hedgehogs. Not only are they less nutrition-dense than live or canned insects, but they pose a risk of causing a blockage in the hedgie's digestive tract. If your mom doesn't want live insects in her house, try going for canned ones. They are all dead, so your mom won't worry, and they are also healthier than dried insects.


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## Yukidama's mama (Apr 4, 2017)

Veebs84 said:


> Look on amazon - you can get all sorts of dried insects - mealworms ad crickets etc. Mealworms are good and what my previous boy had. I'm planning to give Marjorie a variety but mostly freeze dried - pets at home sell if thats helps - because i don't get through the fresh ones fast enough! I had a box of meal worms that mutated into beatles that put me right off! On reflection, they were 'too old' when i bought them but quite alarming!!!
> 
> Wilko also sell dry mealworms in pet section


Hey Veebs84, just a heads up the freeze dried aren't very good for your hedgie and if fed too many too frequently can cause impaction, see Hockeyhogs post above too.

If buying live mealworms, they need to be kept in the fridge to stop them from pupating and turning into beetles. But you can feed those beetles too to your hog or start your own mealworm breeding farm and never have to buy them from the store again! Haha

If using canned, they'll need to be kept in the fridge and last about a week before starting to smell (when removing the lid). Since I only have one hedgehog (atm!) I freeze half the can on the first day of opening and feed the rest of the fresh canned ones then use the frozen ones. Freezing canned insects is different to buying freeze dried insects, and are fine to use on a daily basis unlike freeze dried. Hope this helps 

@Ria, hopefully your mum will allow you to put canned insects in the fridge! They are in a tight concealed can container and don't smell so she wouldn't notice. If you freeze some yourself again they won't smell in the freezer. Just thaw the amount you need, don't let the whole contained thaw and refreeze though.


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

We have two fridge/freezers at the moment due to brothers and drinks. I can hide them in that one, she doesnt go in there that often and at least they are dead. Although she would prefer that these insects didnt leave my room. Cant really be helped.
Shes agreed to live grashoppers because she doesnt mind those, but she hates the other suggestions I gave her. I’m not even 100% that grasshoppers are on the list I cant remember, at the time I was just trying to come up with insects that werent all worms for her sake.
I didnt want the live meal worms eaither incase Holly decided to hide it in the cage and then I’ll have beetles in there. Which she still moght not eat. 

We are going to go down to pets at home and have a look at what we can get there. If canned would be better then I’ll have to have a hugeeee dicussion. I’m not against feeding holly insects if thats what she needs its only really her not liking the thought having them in her house. Maybe a hedgehog wasnt the best pet to keep while living with my mum. But oh well.

Will have a look this week at and hopfully if we dont order them because delivery isnt really great to this house she’ll have some insects by the end of the week. 

Thank you guys for all your help 🙂


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## Draenog (Feb 27, 2012)

Mealworms are relatively high in fat yes, but there are plenty of other feeders that have lower fat levels. Mealworms aren't the only feeder insect around.

Some places also sell frozen insects (not freeze dried), those are ideal. They're dead but still nutricious. Topinsect is a commonly used brand.


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

Thank you. I’ll have a look at the biggest pet shop, then if they dont have anything I’ll have a look online and see what I can get there. I’ll avoid freeze dried and dried as you said they arent good for them.

Thank you so much.


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

So was thinking of getting canned meal worms, and maybe canned crickets or grasshoppers I’m not sure which would be better for her.
My mum has agreed to lettng me have these as they are all dead.

To start with I was thinking of getting just canned meal worms and see how she goes with that. Then maybe after a while try either crickets or grasshoppers depends on which is better and which one I can get easier.

I’m not really that sure on how many or grasshoppers or circkets they can have. But I belive I read somewhere that with mealworms they should only have about 5 a day. But I cant fully remember.


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

Okay so I went to pets at home, to their reptile section for the first time ever. Anyway they only have canned crickets, which I’m pretty sure is okay, but will look at other places for other things to give a wider variety. Anyway would crickets be okay for the insect or should I try find something else as the first insect to try her on ??


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## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

Crickets are fine to feed. It's best to have a variety but crickets are safe to feed.


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

I will get some others, but we have to either order them or try to find another pet shop near that sells them. So I will get her a variety as soon as I can get some others. As long as the crickets are fine then thats okay for now.


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

Sooooo I tried giving Holly a cricket as a treat anddddd she didnt seem interseted in it. Barley sniffed it.
Anyway then I put it in with a bit of her food for her during her outside cage time. Anddddddd shes still not touched it.
How long should I try getting her to eat these crickets before giving up hope on them getting eaten ??


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## Yukidama's mama (Apr 4, 2017)

I believe you should try a minimum of 20 times even more before deciding they don't like something. So don't give up just yet! ^^

Did you leave one in her cage during the night? Sometimes Yuki won't touch a non favourite insect whilst out during bonding but I'll then leave it in his cage and most times he'll eat them in his own time when lights are off


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## chelspjones (Jun 12, 2018)

Looks like you've already received a lot of good information and know now that yes, they do have to have insects. It's essential and not feeding them is robbing them of their natural diet.
I just wanted to note that a lot of information on forums and even from breeders is incorrect. We rescued our little guy 3 years ago and information is more available now, but still poor. After seeing a vet that doesn't agree at all with feeding cat food, I was heartbroken that I had been feeding cat foods and researching into them as much as I did. We feed Mazuri per vet recommendations and he loves it. I felt like I had jipped him of better food after getting that and seeing how much he loved it.
But, along with that, we feed insects, meats, fruits and veggies - all balanced out.
Many breeders aren't giving out essential info and are modifying these animals' diets. The vet mentioned many other clients being told not to feed insects as it makes them 'stink.' I've never experienced this due to feeding insects, but even if I had, would never consider not feeding what's essential.
These forums are good, but information from an exotic vet is essential. It breaks my heart how many hedgies are going without what's needed,.


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

Yukidama's mama said:


> I believe you should try a minimum of 20 times even more before deciding they don't like something. So don't give up just yet! ^^
> 
> Did you leave one in her cage during the night? Sometimes Yuki won't touch a non favourite insect whilst out during bonding but I'll then leave it in his cage and most times he'll eat them in his own time when lights are off


At first I tried during bonding time, but she didnt want it, so I left for during bonding time, and then put it in her cage over night, and it was still untouched. So I threw it away this morning because it had been out all night and I didnt think it was a good idead to leave it there all day, and then I'm going to put a new one in her cage again tonight. I just wanted to see how long I should try before decided that she just really doesnt like it.
I'm in the process of trying to find some canned mealworms. I found a lot of places for dried, but as I was told that dried isnt good for them I didnt even bother getting them.

Thank you so much to everyone for all the help !! I really do appreciate all of it


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## Yukidama's mama (Apr 4, 2017)

Ok, just keep trying and yep dispose of uneaten food (kibble and insects) the following day and replace with fresh ones. 

You could also try cutting one up, might make it smell more (so she realises it's food). 

I buy canned insects online here. ZooMed do a range called "Can O..."Can get mealworms, caterpillars, mini crickets, snails and more... Some big retailers might stock them or might be easier just ordering online if you can.


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

I’ll try cutting one in half tonight, they are a bit big to be fair, so that could play a part in her not wanting it. 

The crickets I got from the shop are zoomeds can o
They didnt have any others just the crickets but I’m not sure if they sell them or if they just didnt have any that day. I then did a search on Amazon to see if I can get other canned insectd and found a load of the zoomeds ones, except when I found them they were out of stock. So I’ll just look again soon.

I’m hoping she will eat one, I did try last night she sniffed it a lot more than the first time I tried, so maybe tonight she might actually eat one.


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## Yukidama's mama (Apr 4, 2017)

Ah ok! I get the mini cricket ones they also do, they're like hedgie bite size haha ^^

That's a good sign then! Try cutting one up and hopefully she'll be tempted


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

Hopfully
I’ll have look for the the mini ones they seem like a better choice, less hassle of having to cut them. To make it easier for her as well.
Thank you for sugestion.
Will say when she eventually eats one !!


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## Draenog (Feb 27, 2012)

chelspjones said:


> Looks like you've already received a lot of good information and know now that yes, they do have to have insects. It's essential and not feeding them is robbing them of their natural diet.
> I just wanted to note that a lot of information on forums and even from breeders is incorrect. We rescued our little guy 3 years ago and information is more available now, but still poor. After seeing a vet that doesn't agree at all with feeding cat food, I was heartbroken that I had been feeding cat foods and researching into them as much as I did. We feed Mazuri per vet recommendations and he loves it. I felt like I had jipped him of better food after getting that and seeing how much he loved it.
> But, along with that, we feed insects, meats, fruits and veggies - all balanced out.
> Many breeders aren't giving out essential info and are modifying these animals' diets. The vet mentioned many other clients being told not to feed insects as it makes them 'stink.' I've never experienced this due to feeding insects, but even if I had, would never consider not feeding what's essential.
> These forums are good, but information from an exotic vet is essential. It breaks my heart how many hedgies are going without what's needed,.


Unfortunately many vets don't know much about hedgehog nutrition and still recommend Mazuri despite it having crap ingredients.


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

So Holly is a right little pest !!
She wouldnt eat the crickets. Last night I cute two in half and gave them to her in her food. Woke up this morning, and shes eaten all her crickets.. but not the cat food !!
Honestly dont know what to do with her haha.


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

So I know this isnt the same topic, but cant work out the right place for it to go.

When I first got Holly her poo was green, and it has been, when I’ve been switching her food when she eats more of the old food her poo is green, and then when she eats more of the new food its not, and it looks better.
I dont want to cause her to not eat but just suddenly taking her old food away, but I’m sure its this thats upsetting her stomach making her poo green.
The old food has fish and fish directives, and I think its this thats causing the green poo.
But Holly loves the choice, of two differnt foods. And I dont want her to start not eating by suddenly taking away her old food.
But do you think that this would be a good idea ??
I have another food I can that would be fine for her, or should I try adding that and then slowly take away the old from that mix ??

I’m really happy shes eaten the cricket, and will carry on trying with other insects so she has the variety. 
But I really need someones opinon on the cat food.

If I found a good dog food which will be easier for no fish traces at all, and then broke the peices of food down to make them smaller for her to eat would this be okay ??


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## Veebs84 (Sep 6, 2018)

Yukidama's mama said:


> Hey Veebs84, just a heads up the freeze dried aren't very good for your hedgie and if fed too many too frequently can cause impaction, see Hockeyhogs post above too.
> 
> If buying live mealworms, they need to be kept in the fridge to stop them from pupating and turning into beetles. But you can feed those beetles too to your hog or start your own mealworm breeding farm and never have to buy them from the store again! Haha
> 
> ...


Yakidama's mum, thank you very much for the info. I thought freeze dried were ok, but will not use now. I don't think I can cope with my own meal worm farm yet, as much as I know iI should haha so will look for canned and change ASAP. I really appreciate you telling me this  I could deal with mini meal worms in the fridge i guess so if difficulties getting banned will do this. ditching my freeze dried though as very worried I've heart my Marjorie 

Thank you! xx


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## Veebs84 (Sep 6, 2018)

Draenog said:


> Mealworms are relatively high in fat yes, but there are plenty of other feeders that have lower fat levels. Mealworms aren't the only feeder insect around.
> 
> Some places also sell frozen insects (not freeze dried), those are ideal. They're dead but still nutricious. Topinsect is a commonly used brand.


Thanks so much for this - very helpful


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

Holly now loves crickets😂
All her “I wont eat it” and she loves them now !! So pleased that I have one insect I know she’ll eat !! I gave them to her again tonight before putting her in her cage and she absolutely loved them !! Scoffed it right down. Blink and you missed it going😂 

Anyway I’m certain its the fish and fish diractives from her old food making her poo green. As its always been green ever since I had her, and ever since eating the new food, speciallg when she eats more of the new food he poo really does look better and its not really green.


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## Yukidama's mama (Apr 4, 2017)

Ah that's great you finally had success! Are you still cutting them up for her or will she eat them whole now? Just curious  

Re the green poop. It could be certain ingredients but it's also normal for them to get green poop when first bringing home and switching the food. 
So what is your food plan, to completely switch her off the old food and onto the new food or feed half and half? If you want to switch off the old food completely, then just continue to do it very slowly. I wouldn't add another new food until she stops having green poops as this will upse her stomach even more. Plus crickets are new for her and another thing her stomach is getting used to so just let her settle on her new food regime for now then once no more green poops then start adding in your second new food choice. As far as I know dog food is ok to use provided the nutritional values are correct for a hedgehog.

Not sure if I've mentioned this before, but buy some probiotics. benebac for small animals is really good and is what I used, it aids the stomach when it is under stress. It really helps get rid of the green poop whenever my boy has bouts of it. Just sprinkle a pinch or two on their food a few times a week. If the green poop continues for a long time even when she is settled on her new foods then it might be time for a vet visit as she could have a bacteria infection in her GI system. This is what Yuki ending up having and antiobitics got rid of his green poop issue. Every so often he still gets some but it's a different kind of green poop (not inky or dark green), just a light olive green tinge lol.


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

She will will eat them whole now. But only small ones, so as most of the crickets in the can I have are fairly big I’m still going to cut those one, but looking into getting the small ones you mentioned.

My plan is to take to her off the old food completely. For one I dont know all the all meat used it just says meat and meat directives with 14% Chicken, so who knows what the rest of that meat is. The green poo has been there consistantly since having her, but its not green when she eats more new than old which is why I thought maybe theres something in the old one upsetting her stomach.
I was going to wait a few weeks after he being on the new food completly before giving her another food, if I was to get dog food I would do all the checks I would with the cat food, and if I cant find a good one then I’ll go back to look at cat food.

I’ll have a look for benebac to help. I know her stomach has a little to deal with at the moment. Its a fair change for her, thats why I was only going to introduce one insect for now, because I thought that would help with her diet and nuitrients since her old food doesnt actually give her much just gives her a lot of fat.


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## Yukidama's mama (Apr 4, 2017)

Ok I see. So ho far into the switch are you? 50% new / 50% old, or more or less of one? 
If she seems to eat more of the new than the old and you're sure its the old food that's causing the green then perhaps start the next phase of the switch eg 75% new and 25% old or just a little less old and see how she goes the next few days. If it gets worse then don't add any more new food. This is just my opinion.

Definitely try to get some benebac, petsmart / pets at home might have it or I got mine off amazon. 

Yep it's a good thing to start introducing the insects ^^ since she likes one, she'll probably like other types too


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## Ria (Aug 30, 2018)

Shes been on 50 new 50 old all this week, I was going to start on the 75 new 25 old tonight or tomorrow night, she seems to prefer the new most night but there are still some nights she would rather the old. And after those nights her poo looks very green. Where as the nights that she has more of the new her poo doesnt seem to come out so green. 
Ofcourse I do know there could be the fact its got slightly more green due to switching food but I’m pretty sure theres something in that old food thats upsetting her stomach.
I was thinking of dog or puppy dry food in the mix because I had a little look and there must be at least one that she will like/can have. But I think I’ll leave adding any other dry food until a few weeks after shes changed food, same with adding any other insects, I dont want to put too much on her right now.
As I’m going out shopping today I’ll stop at pets at home and have a look for the benebac.


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