# Vomitting and other concerns



## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

Hello

My hedgehog vomitted while eating. she was acting normal before she vomitted and after she vomitted. This is the first time we have tried free feeding her. I have checked other threads, but nothing really suggests that she has food poisoning or an infection. She has been eating the same food (wellness and green pea and duck) for the past two weeks. Is it possible that she just ate too fast? Her vomit looked just like frothy wellness.

She is also having some hair loss, but not much. She used to scratch herself a lot, but now she does not since I have been giving her flax seed oil. I read that hairloss sometimes occurs in the spring (getting a new coat of hair for the new season?)

Her stools are fine, she has been drinking enough water and she runs on her wheel too much(all night for hours). She doesn't like fruit, but eats chicken and mealworms. She is about 6 months old

Cleaned her cage last night. No more vomit since she did it last night and seems to be her usual energetic self. She is also litter-trained (I'm so fortunate that she uses her litterbox religiously for pee and poo)

Should I be concerned about her vomit (it seems like a one time thing) and the hair loss?

Thank you forumers in advance


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## Kalandra (Aug 25, 2008)

Were any of the pieces she spit up fairly sizable? Maybe she got choked on a big piece and vomited? When I have a hedgehog get sick I start watching them like a hawk. If it happens again, they go to the vet for a checkup. It does not take long at all for a hedgehog to become dehydrated if they are vomiting often.


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## azyrios (Feb 2, 2009)

the hair loss could be attributed to a change of food. When did you first notice the hair loss? Are her poops at all stinky?


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

I know that shes not dehydrated because after she puked she started drinking tons of water. I don't have the vomit saved (i should have put it in a bag), but I do not recall any big pieces. I noticed hair loss a couple of days ago. EDIT: Her poop smells really bad, but its more of a light brown than a green tint. whats shockign is she didnt poo in her litterbox this time, but instead in her pipe which makes no sense to me...

she has not vomitted again since then


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## azyrios (Feb 2, 2009)

she may be allergic to the wellness.
Wellness is very rich food and some hedgehogs cannot digest it fully, which is the smelly poop. It may also have an ingredient that is causing the hair loss.


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

I took her to the vet just in case. good thing i did too, she apparently had a really bad bacterial infection of her gastrointestinal tract. She peed blood when she was there so good thing i got her there in time. She's on some anti-biotics now so I hope for a quick recovery! Really worried though, shes not drinking as much water as I hoped but I believe its because they gave her fluids right before she left the vet!


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

I'm glad you got her to the vet! I hope your little girl gets better fast. Give her lots of love!


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## LizardGirl (Aug 25, 2008)

> It may also have an ingredient that is causing the hair loss.


Which ingredient is this? (just curious)


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

Mcliu, I'm glad you found out what the problem was. As always, whenever there is a concern a vet visit is the best way to proceed. I wish everyone was as concerned and willing to get a vets diagnoses as you have been.  

azyrios, I too am curious what food ingredient would cause hair loss?


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## azyrios (Feb 2, 2009)

LizardGirl said:


> > It may also have an ingredient that is causing the hair loss.
> 
> 
> Which ingredient is this? (just curious)


Just like humans are allergic to peanuts, a hedgehog should be theory be able to be allergic to something weird as well. Where Wellness is to rich for one hedgehog, it is perfectly fine with another. Thus it leads me to believe if some hedgehogs are okay when eating a food, and others loose hair when eating it, they are allergic to an ingredient in it. Since there are so many ingredients he could be allergic to anything, possibly cranberries, possibly flax seed, possibly chicken. It is really to hard to say.

Even trace amounts of peanuts can kill a human, so it could even be one of the trace ingredients.


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

I talked to the vet, she said that hair loss might be caused by the GI infection. 

She's doing much better now, drinking water and eating food on a regular basis. She is still on anti-biotics though since her poo is still tinted green. Oh and surprisingly she was slightly overweight at 305 grams! We have been feeding her a total of 14-16 kibbles a day too (thats 3/7 of a tablespoon on average)! I was surprised. 

At least shes kind of back to normal though I'm sure she hates the clavamox (anti-biotic).


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

I'm glad she's getting back to normal.  

Most of my gang have loved clavamox after the first few days. I've even had a few that would get up and wait for me when they new it was time for their meds and would suck it out of the syringe. :lol:


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

clavamox actually doesn't taste that bad (I accidentally tried it, got some on my fingers its kind of sweet), but I think her aversion is the fact that she wont stay still at all no matter what I try so I have to flip her on her back to feed her. Her poo looks fine now, but I think she developed an ingrown hair on her chin. She looks like a hedgehog version of confucius right now except less philosophical.


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

UPDATE: She doesn't have the ingrown hair//bump on her chin anymore. Not sure what it was but it disappeared in a couple of hours. Her poop looks better than before and she looks more energetic. She unlitter trained herself so I have to relitter train her again (She pooped in her food dish after she ate the food....)


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## azyrios (Feb 2, 2009)

she is just recycling =D
and technically i think pooping in a dish counts as litter trained. At least she knows poop goes in bowl.


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

Lol about pooping in her food bowl. Silly hedgie. :lol: 
Be careful about feeding her on her back though, I've heard that they can choke a bit on food/water/medicine if they're on their back.


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

thanks for the advice lilysmom. I'm just feeding her how the vet showed me. She said that the amount of liquid (.06mL) is not enough for a hedgehog to choke on but I should still be careful. =)


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

Ah, yes, that does seem like a pretty small amount. Just thought I'd let you know.  I hope she's doing better!


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

Oh she is doing much better now! We switched her to a larger bin and I'm working on attaching a second story to it. Hope she will have lots of fun in it =). Her poop doesnt smell anymore and the consistency of her poop is not green and mushy anymore. The only issue is is that its not as firm as it usually is but thats probably because of the lack of fiber in her current diet compared to a couple of weeks ago. I wanted to hold off feeding her mealworms and crickets just for a while because of the possible bacteria that are in mealies and crickets that may upset her GI even more. She will be back on insects on friday when I can go pick up some fresh ones!

PS: for some reason she likes sleeping with her food bowl. Just a while ago she just dragged her bowl from one side of the bin to the other side just to have the food bowl resting on top of her while she sleeps. I'm not sure if that was intentional, but definitely very funny to me =).

Also, her weight seems to be returning to normal now. Instead of being overweight 0.o she doesnt have anymore excess fat around her arms. I am really curious though, LizardGirls hedgehog is smaller than mine, but if I recall correctly she feeds her hedgie approximately 2 tablespoons of food each day. My hedgehog is 300 grams and I can only feed her around 16 kibbles (1/3 tablespoon) a day to keep her from being overweight. Should I try free feeding her so she can adjust or what? I still feel like I'm starving her even though the vet said I should cut back....(i should listen to the vet huh?) I feed her wellness and green pea and duck so you guys can have an idea of how big the kibbles are


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

Well, hedgehogs are kind of like humans. Some put on weight more easily than others. LizardGirl's hedgie, Inky, loves to run. He needs the extra food/fat because he burns it all up as he runs all night. Yours might not run on her wheel as much, or just might have a body type that is more likely to put on weight. So you can't feed her as much, or she'll put on more weight. 

Sleeping with her food bowl on her... :lol: Sounds to me like she might enjoy one of Nancy's hats that she makes! A lot of hedgies like to sleep under them, they're nice and cozy.


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

Sixteen kibble a day is not enough even for one that does tend to be on the 'fluffy' side. I firmly believe they should all be free fed and exercise and changing the way of feeding will help them loose weight. Offer her some vegetable baby food or cooked veggies in the evening so she fills up a bit on that. 

300g is a small hedgehog so unless she has a very tiny frame, are you certain she is overweight?


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## LizardGirl (Aug 25, 2008)

I agree, 16 kibble is not nearly enough. If I were to feed Inky only GP&D and Wellness, he would eat around 50 kibble a night. He is definitely a runner, and has to eat a lot to keep from becoming underweight. (I try to find fatty foods for him, just to keep the weight on) He's currently at around 260-270 grams, and not underweight but I don't think he'll ever get to be overweight.

I wouldn't limit her food unless she doesn't exercise much or just tends to gain a lot of weight quickly. 300 grams is a small hedgie. Hedgies usually gain weight from not exercising. They usually won't overeat, but some will. If you are going to limit kibble, it'd probably be best to free feed for a few days to see how much she will eat on her own, and base the amount on that.


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

Nancy said:


> Sixteen kibble a day is not enough even for one that does tend to be on the 'fluffy' side. I firmly believe they should all be free fed and exercise and changing the way of feeding will help them loose weight. Offer her some vegetable baby food or cooked veggies in the evening so she fills up a bit on that.
> 
> 300g is a small hedgehog so unless she has a very tiny frame, are you certain she is overweight?


According to the vet, she is slightly overweight 0.o


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## LizardGirl (Aug 25, 2008)

It's possible your vet is wrong. Many still go by outdated books, and have very little experience. 

Do you have a picture of her from the top? I really doubt, unless she is really really small and just has a lot of fat, that she is overweight.


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

well she is a really small hedgehog.

A concern that i have right now is when i tried free feeding her this morning she started to vomit what looked like froth. I took the food out then when she started to act normal again, i put the food back in. She started to eat it really fast and then it looked like she wanted to vomit again and she did. again it was frothy so I took the food back out. I tried to take the "vomit" out so I could look at it but she walked all over it before I could pick it up. It was like it didnt even exist. However, I doubt that this vomitting was caused by a bacterial infection since she has been on clavamox for almost 2 weeks now. Her poop is back to normal too. I couldnt really tell if it really was food that was stuck because after a bout of vomitting and smacking her lips a lot she would act as if nothing happened.

also how would i start free feeding her? It seems like if i give her ~40 kibbles she just goes nuts and tries to eat without chewing the kibbles

Here are some pictures of her so you guys can have an idea about how big she is (we have been changing her bedding material from newspaper to bedding. It had to be newspaper when she was sick so I could keep track of vomit and diarrhea when the GI infection was still in full swing)


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## azyrios (Feb 2, 2009)

she definitely does not look obese to me. She is prolly eating to fast because she is ridiculously hungry

Try feeding a small amount of kibble at a time so she doesn't get over excited and just keep refilling it. Also the kibble size may be getting caught in her throat or roof of her mouth. Offer her it in lesser amount (15 kibble) but replace it when it is empty (hive her 16 more). Every time she empties it add 1 more kibble to try and get her back up to 40 kibble. She needs more food or malnutrition can kick in. Also try wetting the food with water to make it soft before feeding so that it can't get stuck anywhere.


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

She doesn't look fat to me either. She might be eating too fast to cause the vomiting or something getting caught in her mouth. What type of kibble is she on? Pellet shape and round kibbles can get caught quite easily in some hedgehogs mouths. You might want to try breaking it up a bit.


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

Nancy said:


> She doesn't look fat to me either. She might be eating too fast to cause the vomiting or something getting caught in her mouth. What type of kibble is she on? Pellet shape and round kibbles can get caught quite easily in some hedgehogs mouths. You might want to try breaking it up a bit.


she eats gp&duck and wellness. the kibbles are small cylindrical shaped. My girlfriend suggests that i crush up some of the kibbles before i give it to her. Maybe she wont get anything caught in her teef


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## LizardGirl (Aug 25, 2008)

The frothing is self-annointing, completely normal. Hedgies do this when they find something they like the smell of.


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## azyrios (Feb 2, 2009)

LizardGirl said:


> The frothing is self-annointing, completely normal. Hedgies do this when they find something they like the smell of.


i don't think that is the type of froth she is talking about. When my dog pukes there is a frothy mixture in it, but she does not anoint.

If your hedgehog rubbing the froth on her quills or just puking it onto the ground?


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

LizardGirl said:


> The frothing is self-annointing, completely normal. Hedgies do this when they find something they like the smell of.


 yeah i know, ive seen her annoint many times before, its just frothy stuff came out because she vomitted it. another thing is that she just pukes it to the ground without licking it all over her quills

I'm sure it was from eating too fast since i've fed her 40 kibbles in 20 kibble increments and I crushed it up and it doesnt even look like she eve bothers chewing, she just kinda swallows it all =\. I think what happened is she tried to swallow a piece that was too big and it got stuck in her throat, ergo vomitting.


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## azyrios (Feb 2, 2009)

she must be very hungry. Keep feeding her and hopefully she will slow down.


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

grrrrrr stupid me...i accidentally left the clavamox outside last night so now i have to go buy a new bottle of clavamox...just when all her symptoms of the GI problem was starting to disappear. hopefully she can live without the medicine for a couple of days while the medicine gets shipped


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

How long was it out and what was the temperature? I've left it out before and it's ok for about 12 hours unless it's hot.


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

oh...it was still cool. it was out for about 6 hours but i already threw it away prior to the post =(


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

That's too bad, it would have been fine.


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## Mcliu (Apr 1, 2009)

Update!

Shes looking much better in terms of poop. For a while after I stopped the clavamox (unintentionally =() her poop wasnt looking so good. Now its back to normal and shes taking larger poops now than ever (attributed to free feeding her now). Thanks for everyone's support!


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