# Newbie cage question



## DarcyB (Jun 9, 2012)

I'm adopting my first hedgehog this summer, and would like to get everything set up. For a multitude of reasons, I'm opting for this cage: http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/p ... atid=17045

Before anyone calls me on it... I'm not the crafty sort, so rather than trying to enclose the ramp and shelf, I plan on removing them, which has the added benefit of providing enough clearance for a CSW.

Extrapolating from the picture and measurements I've been able to find online, it would seem the pan is only about 4-5" deep. Since the bars are horizontal rather than vertical, I assume this poses a climbing risk. So, I guess I really have two questions: 1) Am I being overly paranoid, or is the cage on its own a potential hazard? 2) If it is a legitimate risk, what's the easiest barrier to construct given my extremely un-primate-like inability to use tools?

Thanks!


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## HedgieGirl519 (Oct 21, 2011)

You didn't say which cage size you were getting. The 30x18 is too small, it only has 3.75 square feet. The 24x24 is JUST big enough. For that price, you can make a much bigger cage.

When you put the CSW into that cage, you will have 3 square feet left, it will take up one whole corner. When you put an igloo in, in combination with the CSW, half the cage is gone. It is honestly a very small cage. 

Climbing is a hazard. You want something solid to be at least 8" up the sides. So you will have to put coroplast or something else up the sides at least 4" extra. Some people will say you don't have to, but really, is it worth the risk? Better safe than sorry and it's such an easy fix. 

Coroplast is the easiest to use. You just cut it to size, which in this case would be:
4 pieces of coroplast that are 4"x24". Then you just poke a few holes and zip tie or cable tie them to the bars. It's very simple 

But yeah, you can make a much bigger C&C for that price. The more room the better. That cage isn't going to provide much room at all.


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## HedgieGirl519 (Oct 21, 2011)

For a 28x28 C&C the grids would cost around $20 and the coroplast around $10. I'm sure you'd rather pay less than half for a bigger cage


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## DarcyB (Jun 9, 2012)

Thanks for the quick and insightful reply.

Again, zero crafty skillz means I refuse to construct a cage myself. I don't care how easy it may be, if I lay my hands on it, it will surely be a death trap. So pre-made it is.

Also: Holy pseudonym, Batman! I've had it hammered into my brain that 4ft^2 is the required floor space for a single hedgehog. But you're absolutely right, the difference between "required" and "functional" is vast. Wheel, hideaway, food and water dishes, litter pan, enrichment objects...yeah, that's a ton of stuff to fit in four square feet. Fail. On the bright side I hadn't ordered it yet. (FYI, I've spent weeks trying to find a cage that met requirements for both the hedgie and my home. Cannot believe it never dawned on me how much of that space would be eaten by accessories. Back to the drawing board I go.)


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## HedgieGirl519 (Oct 21, 2011)

If you insist on a store bought cage, this is a good one  Just take out the ramp/extra level. It has 7.75 square feet and the base is 8 

http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.j ... Id=2753350


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

Even though I do have the skills to build a cage, and have built many, I would pay the difference between a store bought plastic bottomed wire topped cage over a C&C any day. I'm not a fan of C&C's. :lol:


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## LarryT (May 12, 2009)

If you have the funds this is one of the best, just secure or remove loft  
http://www.walmart.com/ip/Midwest-Pets- ... h/16901120


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## FamilyOfExotics (May 19, 2012)

I second Larry.. I use the Ferret Nation cage for my two fuzzbuts, and it is beautiful! I would never use anything else  I went through quite a few cages with my fuzzies and this is the only one I have found that they can't make trouble in (which is rare). :lol: 

Reasons it is awesome in my opinion: 
1) It has HUGE doors that open all the way to the sides to allow access to the entire level (makes cleaning and rearranging a breeze) 
2) It is very sturdy and has castors so you can move it around the house
3) You can add an expansion to the top which you could place another hedgie in (the two main levels can be easily sealed off from eachother)
4) It is a very large cage so it gives the hedgie plenty of room to run around even after all the accessories

PS. I have two of these cages, 1 for my fuzzies and 1 for my hedgie-to-be (in separate rooms of course)


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## DarcyB (Jun 9, 2012)

Hm. I repeatedly looked at the Ferret Nation set-up, as I saw the name pop-up on every forum I visited. I balked at the price, though. (I'm beginning to think it would be cheaper and easier for me to adopt a child. Fewer hard-to-find specialty items. And it's much easier to find a reputable pediatrician than a good exotics vet with hedgie experience and a willingness to come in for off-hours emergency calls.) But. It's really not *that* much more than what I was hoping to spend. And I do need something with a little ground clearance, as this building was built in the late 1800s, and I'm slightly concerned about possible drafts, even with the enclosure away from windows and exterior walls. Floof. I'm sure I'd end up upgrading at some point anyway; might as well save the double cage expense and get something proper the first time around...

Those crossbars... It looks like they're at the eight-inch mark, yes? So no rigging of barriers would be required? And is a single CHE enough to maintain a reasonable temperature? (I'd planned on just resting the lamp atop the cage, rather than clamping it to a side wall or buying a stand.) On an entirely different note, I'm under the impression a wheel is essentially, for lack of a more precise term, an excrement centrifuge. Without any sidewalls, is there an issue with the wheel flinging urine and feces outside of the cage? Or does proper placement of the wheel prevent this fairly well?

Thank you to everyone who has responded. You guys are the cold illest and the advice is all greatly appreciated. I'm sure it's somewhat trying to answer the same set of novice questions time and time again.


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## HedgieGirl519 (Oct 21, 2011)

The Ferret Nations are really good, they are the first cage that I normally recommend. For the design, structure and size of the cage, the price isn't too much. There is is 6 square feet without the loft, and 9 with it. I know you said you aren't crafty, but the loft is VERY easy to secure . The only skills you need is how to poke a few holes and use zip ties  

There are lots of people who upgraded to a Ferret Nation and said they wished they had done it in the first place. It really is worth the money. 

The crossbars are at 6". But you don't need to block them off, no. However weaving placemats (from the dollar store) through the bars helps keep heat in. You just cut them to 6" wide and weave them through, it's super easy.  It's not required, but really does help with the heating. 

You can sit the CHE right on top of the cage. You will either need 1 or 2 CHE's, it depends on your room and the temperature. If you block the sides, more heat stays in. If you put a piece of fleece along the back of the cage (so cut to 24"x36"), it keeps more heat in. 

Yes, hedgehogs MUST have a wheel. They run like crazy on their wheels all night . They need the wheel for entertainment/natural purposes and health. If they don't have a wheel, they get over weight very quickly, which you don't want at all. In the wild hedgehogs run for miles and miles each night, they keep doing this in captivity as well. So if they don't have a wheel they get bored as well. A bored hedgehog will trash his/her cage, try to escape, etc. In the wild they also poop and pee while they run, this cannot be stopped. So every morning your wheel will be caked in poop. 

Sometimes poop or pee will hit the walls, it's not uncommon. But if you position the wheel with the back of it facing the wall, it's not a big problem. You want to make sure you have a litter box UNDER the wheel. As they run, they poop and pee, the pee runs off into the litter box and the poop falls off into the litter box. For litter you can use toilet paper, paper towel or Yesterdays New Original Formula Cat Litter. The easiest thing is toilet paper, since you can just flush it once daily. 

The best and most recommended wheels are the Carolina Storm Wheel and Carolina Storm Bucket Wheel. They are $25 and $30 + shipping, but are 110% worth it. The ONLY other option is to either make your own bucket wheel or buy the 12" Giant Comfort Wheel, which is around $20-$25. The Comfort Wheel needs to be secured to the cage because it can fall on top of the hedgehog, it is loud and is absolutely terrible to clean. That wheel you really have to scrub, but the Carolina Wheels are smooth and a breeze to clean, they are also completely quiet and safe


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

Take a look at Zorropirate's post and picture of how she uses a CHE in the Ferret Nation. I think this is a brilliant idea for those who don't use the loft. The CHE does need to be securely fastened to the shelf so it can't slide off. 

WIth a FN, the back should be enclosed just to help hold the heat in. This can be done with coroplast or fabric as long as there is no way of it touching the CHE. 

Weaving plastic in and out of the bars up to the first horizontal bar not only helps hold a bit of heat in but it also keeps any stray poop or food from falling out of the cage.


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## DarcyB (Jun 9, 2012)

I've read nothing but horrible things about the store bought wheels...stability issues, cleaning issues, loud noises, and one that forces the animal to perpetually run with an odd gait. (Furthering my belief that the vast majority of pet products are designed by people with zero knowledge of animal behavior, native environments, or basic anatomy...just tons of knowledge on marketing.) I actually have Larry's site bookmarked and filed in the "needs" portion of my hedgie shopping list. It wasn't question of whether to get Carolina Storm Wheel, I was just curious if I should be expecting daily scrubbing outside the enclosure when using a wire cage. Forewarned is forearmed, and all that.  Very happy to hear most of it does make it into the pan. I'm really not enough of a morning person to handle half an hour of scrubbing urine off my walls before I've had my coffee.

Thanks for the heating tips. A crafty friend snagged a bolt of good fleece for me during a going-out-of-business sale at a local fabric shop. There should be plenty to both make the liners and a drop cloth for the back of the cage. And now that you mention it, I do have a vague recollection of reading about the plastic placemats being utilized in some fashion, but at the time it didn't register how exactly. Must have been heat retention. I'll add those to the list. 

Is everyone this overwhelmed when setting up for their first hedgehog? I realize raising an exotic is a wee bit more involved than raising a mouse, but, wow. Every time I think I have things figured out, I get a new piece of information that reminds me I have no idea what I'm doing. And I'm a fairly clever chick. I keep thinking about this awful local pet store chain, best known for getting their dogs from puppy mills and giving misinformation about snakes. They sell sugar gliders, hedgehogs, and all manner of pets. How many times has someone walked out of there having impulse-bought a hedgie, a hamster cage, a sack of cedar chips, and a box of rodent food? Ugh. Anyway. I will continue to beg you all for information, and once I have things put together, I'll post a pic in hopes someone will spot anything I've overlooked. Having a proper hedgehog set-up has become my Everest; I *will* get this worked out, or die trying. (If the next post you see is a heart-rending tale of loss written by my Sherpa, please send donations to hedgie rescues in lieu of flowers.)


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## DarcyB (Jun 9, 2012)

Nancy said:


> Take a look at Zorropirate's post and picture of how she uses a CHE in the Ferret Nation. I think this is a brilliant idea for those who don't use the loft. The CHE does need to be securely fastened to the shelf so it can't slide off.


That really is clever. Seems like decreasing the distance between the heat source and the target area should increase the consistency of the temperature. (...Says the girl with no background in thermodynamics.) Definitely an idea worth playing with. Thanks!


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