# bringing baby home...



## pixiedreamer (Nov 11, 2009)

I am driving about an hour and 45 minutes away on november 29th to get my baby hedgie 

But I'm concerned. Should I get him a cat carrier or a soft plush carrier? And what should I put in it to ensure him to stay warm? He's not going to roll around in the carrier is he??!!??!? D:

I'm just so anxious and worried about bringing him home :/ I just want my baby to be safe <3


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## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

You should have your hedgie in a hard sided cat carrier and have it seat-belted in the vehicle...put some fleece blankets in the carrier and if its cold out you can use some hand warmers or hot packs to keep him warm..just make sure they are well wrapped up too.


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## aesthetics (Sep 2, 2009)

We got my female early July, and we just got a rather large box, and I put a fleece blanket inside. Generally, she was so nervous, and unsure what was going on, she stayed underneath the fleece. This is probably all you need, if you're not going to leave it in the car. Depending on where you live, you might want to have the heater on and stuff.


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## krbshappy71 (Jul 17, 2009)

I have this one in the blue/brown and pink. So far so good. http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.j ... Id=2753365


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## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

the problem with using a box is that if you're in an accident..or even if you have to stop fast..the box is going to go flying and your hedgie along with it. the same with that other carrier. Also if your in an accident and are hurt, unconcious etc, no one will know there was a hedgehog in the vehicle and it would probably be left behind. Emergency personnel are trained to look for conventional pet carriers, the plastic hard sided ones, and those carriers are no where near as likey to be thrown in an accident if its buckled in. You would put a human baby in a box in a car, why take the chance with your four-legged baby? its just a dangerous for them.


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## pixiedreamer (Nov 11, 2009)

Thanks everyone  I really appreciate the help  I want my baby to be as safe as can be and getting help from you guys is wonderful 

<3<3<3<3


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## aesthetics (Sep 2, 2009)

Well, there are roughly six million car accidents a year, with over 320 million people living in the country, only which 42,000 a year are serious, in which there were fatalities. You're talking about a 0.0119% chance. 

If the distance isn't that far, and you're driving during the day, then why not? People can, and will always go on about "what if".


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## Zalea (Sep 12, 2008)

When it comes to a hedgehog it is better safe than sorry. Many accidents happen within 1 mile of the home, so the "isn't that far" method isn't really logical. It's better to plan for "what if" than to deal with the loss of a pet later--the old "one ounce of prevention saves a pound of heartache" deal. If you have the hedgie in a box or a soft carrier and you DO get into an accident, one that you absolutely cannot see coming like someone t-boning you at a stoplight and you can't avoid even though it's daytime, the hedgie can go flying across the car and be killed, or get out and get lost--whereas if you had them in a hardsided carrier with piles of fleece in the bottom that wouldn't be an issue. It may be a slight chance, but there is that chance. It is better to plan for the "what if" and hope it doesn't happen than to have it happen and not be prepared.

One other reason for a hard-sided carrier is that emergency personnel are trained to look for those carriers, as Nikki said. Otherwise your hedgie might be left freezing at the scene of an accident during winter, or have a heat stroke for the same reason in summer.

A hard-sided carrier runs about $15-20 at Wal-mart and will last the lifetime of your hedgie, and likely the lifespan of any future hedgies you have. A small contribution to give a beloved pet a fighting shot in the case of a "what if" does not cost that much, especially when most people spent about $200 to get their hedgehog in the first place. If you can't afford to buy a $20 carrier, how will you afford vet bills, etc in the future? Of course, can't afford and don't want to are two different things...but how could you not want to when the well-being of a treasured pet is at stake? Most of hedgehog ownership is about prevention--preventing falls, hairs around legs, diet troubles, etc. This is just one more prevention step to keep our companions safe and as healthy as possible. 

It's up to you what carrier you use, but there's a reason seasoned hedgehog owners recommend hard-sided ones.

Pixiedreamer, for a 2 hour drive, you definitely need a hard-sided carrier. Any number of things could happen between there and home. Be sure not to put the heat from the vents directly onto the cage--it can become too hot--and use the handwarmers and a few layers of fleece in the carrier to keep your little guy warm and toasty. Warm the car up for a few minutes before you take him out to it, and cover the carrier with a blanket before taking it outside. It's also a good idea to get a thermometer to put in the cage to ensure it's not too hot or cold in there.


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## pixiedreamer (Nov 11, 2009)

Zalea, thanks  I will take that all in mind. I am defiently the type to be safe than sorry :3 and I actually found a hard sided cat carrier at petsmart that's actually kitten size which is perfect for a hedgie 

Thanks again for the help <3<3<3<3<3


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## krbshappy71 (Jul 17, 2009)

Ah, I apologize for suggesting a carrier that isn't recommended. I'm still new and thought that because mine was not soft and collapsable it would be considered hard-sided. (meaning, it wasn't a hedgie-bag or purse, it is firm on the sides and keeps its shape.) Looks like I should switch to a different carrier for in-car-use and use the pretty one for taking it from car to destination such into the vet office, friend's house, etc. I was seat-belting it in, so thought that was what mattered. Thanks for the clarification.


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## Zalea (Sep 12, 2008)

krbshappy71, those carriers are great for in the store and out of the car. I have one myself.  The drawback is that they crush really easily, though, so if something of decent weight were to fall on it, the hedgie could be injured.

Laura Dunklee wrote an article for the Hedgehog Welfare Society Newsletter entitled "Safely Transporting Your Hedgehog: An Argument for Hard-Sided Carriers". It's on page 9 of the July/August 2008 issue, located on the HWS website: http://www.hedgehogwelfare.org/. Click newsletter on the left menu, then scroll down to HWS Newsletter #36, July - August, 2008. (I tried direct linking but it's being difficult. Sorry!)

I think it's worth a read for everyone when they start thinking about what's best for transportation.

*edited to fix the link and make the article easier to locate*


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## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

aesthetics...Your "logic" could be applied to wearing seatbelts, using car seats for kids, airbags, and many other safety devices, why use any of them if the risk is so small? I work in EMS and I see what happens when people think like you do..its not pretty and definately not worth the risk.


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## mel2626 (Sep 28, 2009)

KRB- I have the same carrier and they actually make a small cage that fits inside that carrier. It virtually makes it a cage and carrier in one.  

~Melissa


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## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

even with a cage inside that carrier isn't safe for travel in a vehicle...


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## Linsoid (Nov 3, 2009)

I have the same carrier and cage set up for quick travel with mine. I have actually put mine through some tough tests (whacking, smashing and whatnot with no animal inside of course) and it stood those tests. What makes it an unsafe carrier? It seems a lot like a cat carrier in my eyes, so I am just trying to see where the flaw in the product is


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## aesthetics (Sep 2, 2009)

nikki said:


> aesthetics...Your "logic" could be applied to wearing seatbelts, using car seats for kids, airbags, and many other safety devices, why use any of them if the risk is so small? I work in EMS and I see what happens when people think like you do..its not pretty and definately not worth the risk.


Okay, Nikki.

Relating a hedgehog safely placed inside a box, which you're sitting next to is not relatable to a law. You can get pulled over for not wearing a seatbelt. Clearly, my "logic" is assumed.

I was simply alluding to the fact, anything can be a what if. What if you did take a fancy carrier, but your (not your, but the general 'your') seven year old child was holding it during a collision? And received whiplash with the constricting seatbelt, inevitably causing the hedgehog to fall? Then what would you do? What if the carrier flew out a window, or broke through one. A large box, sterilite container (which I'm actually referring to), doesn't exactly have as much leisure to escape, as say, a small little pet container does.

My logic is, people shouldn't always base things on "what if". We drove three hours to get my female, she was housed in a box for that time, and everything was fine. The box was so large, it was safely nestled behind the driver's seat and the back seat. You couldn't move it, unless you titled it to the side, and pulled it out with the bottom laying across the back seat. A "speedy stop" didn't throw it.

It is probably more safe than some little container. This is all I was trying to say.


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

aesthetics said:


> nikki said:
> 
> 
> > aesthetics...Your "logic" could be applied to wearing seatbelts, using car seats for kids, airbags, and many other safety devices, why use any of them if the risk is so small? I work in EMS and I see what happens when people think like you do..its not pretty and definately not worth the risk.
> ...


And why would a "seven year old" be holding the carrier. The point of a proper hard sided carrier is so that it can be safely buckled into the seat just the same as a childs car seat or humans are buckled in.

Hard sided cat/pet carriers, especially the airline approved ones are designed for safety and protection of the animal. Many of them have seat belt attachment points but even if the don't, it's not rocket science to securely buckle one in.

For a hedgehog, the size of a small hard sided pet carrier is ideal. It offers enough room to add fleece that acts as both bedding but helps to cushion any impact against the sides of the carrier. Because it is smaller, the distance the hedgehog would travel in a sudden stop is not very far.

In an accident emergency personnel will look for pet carriers and a hard sided pet carrier is readily recognizable. A box, plastic bin, or even some of the designer cloth type carriers can be overlooked.

The safest place for any pet when traveling is in a hard sided pet carrier. They are so cheap I really don't understand the argument. If someone doesn't want to pay $20 for one, watch the thrift stores, flea markets, yard sales, craigs list or kijiji for a used one. Geez, you can even ask for one on your local Freecycle group. Not only is the carrier needed for travel, if hedgie has to stay over at the vet, being in the carrier gives a safe environment filled with his/her own bedding. In the event of a power outage, the carrier can become a temporary cage giving a smaller area to try and keep warm.

When it is so easy to provide a safe environment why not do it? Sure the possibility of being in an accident is slim but I'm willing to bet every single person who has gotten in an accident didn't think it would happen to them.


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## mel2626 (Sep 28, 2009)

I guess I'm not understanding the difference of a hard carrier or a cage/carrier combo. The combo one isn't exactly soft as someone else stated above and with the cage inside, the walls are pretty hard especially when the cage is inserted (no they are not hard plastic but they are still hard). If this can be buckled in so that hedgie is secure, how is the cage going to go flying through the air or out of the car? Also why would an EMT not realize this is an animal cage~ is it the size? I'm just trying to figure out because this little carrier is perfect for me when driving short distances. I wouldn't bring it on a long trip because it doesn't provide ample room to fit a wheel, igloo etc. For that I could definitely see where the hard carrier would be perfect.

BTW- What about a "Hedgehog on Board" sticker for your vehicle like is done with show dogs? lol Just a thought. :lol:

~Melissa and Miss MuffetI


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

If you mean http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.j ... Id=2753365 That is okay to use. It doesn't provide as much protection as a hard sided cat carrier but he is not going to go flying once he'es buckled in. If that carrier is impacted by something, it will crush far easier than a regular cat/pet carrier.

Between this and a typical hard sided cat carrier, this one will be less obvious as a pet carrier. I have a couple of carriers that are very similar in design and I do on occasion use them in the vehicle if I'm not going very far or not going on the highways. Even though they do have plastic in the sides, they will crush far easier.

Another thing to consider when choosing a carrier for in the vehicle is ventilation. In an accident things go flying around and can land on top of or beside the carrier. Therefore, ventilation on all sides is important in case one, two, or three sides get blocked.


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## aesthetics (Sep 2, 2009)

Well, paper bags, plastic bags, or canvas bags. They all serve one purpose. Everyone has something to say about them. 

There is no "I'm right, you're wrong" way. Many people have used boxes, containers (albeit the majority) does a pet carrier help? Sure, I'm sure it does. Does a container work, too? It did for me. Commanding an air of "this is the right way", should be an option, but don't frown upon other methods. 

And, as always, people have and will make their own choose.


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## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

just because something worked for you doesn't mean its the safest way. The orginal poster wanted to know how to keep her hedgie safe...not just contained. There is a reason why airlines require hard sided carriers for pets, beacuse they are safer..if you are in an accident with your hedgie in a big box like you had its going to bounce around in the box and EMS will never give the box a second look, no matter what stickers are on the vehicle, just because they wouldn't expect an animal to be in something like that and they don't have time to look through every box, bag, etc in a vehicle. If you want to put your pet in danger to save a few dollars that's your choice, but reccomending others do the same is irresponsible. People don't just use car seats for kids because its the law but because they understand that its safer and love their kids enough to want to protect them as best as they can.


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## mel2626 (Sep 28, 2009)

No need to be offensive: my part of my post regarding the sticker was clearly tongue-in-cheek and wasn't recommending that anyone place a sticker on their car in lieu of an appropriate container.


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## aesthetics (Sep 2, 2009)

Although it's pointless to continue; she asked how to bring her hedgehog home. The safety was implied to the questions, as far as heating, etc. I suggested what I did. And, for a matter of fact, it was safe. Because clearly, nothing happened. I don't understand to point of dragging it on.

People will do what they will; and as individuals, we have the right to make our own decisions. As individuals, we have the right to decipher through what we view as safe and unsafe. And so, as I said, it was safe for me. The container was well padded, and insulated. Everyone was happy, and it was an enjoyable ride. Because of a few accidents deeming something unsafe, why don't people just walk, then? Or don't fly in airplanes? Why...? because the risk is SMALL. 

And as per their right, what people choose to bring their hedgehog home in, is inevitably to them. And, sure, the carriers are a fine idea. I've said this three times already. But, the container wasn't "unsafe."I'm not recommending anything, just saying what I did. 

You suggested the carrier, and I the container. Why can't we carry on as that? Again, those inquiring will do as they will.


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## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

pixiedreamer said:


> I am driving about an hour and 45 minutes away on november 29th to get my baby hedgie
> 
> But I'm concerned. Should I get him a cat carrier or a soft plush carrier? And what should I put in it to ensure him to stay warm? He's not going to roll around in the carrier is he??!!??!? D:
> 
> I'm just so anxious and worried about bringing him home :/ I just want my baby to be safe <3


If you read the last line she did say she wanted her hedgie to be safe...and just because you did something and nothing happened doesn't mean it should be recommended to others...some people have travelled with children not properly restrained and nothing has happend...but i wouldn't stand by silently if they recommeded that to someone else.


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## aesthetics (Sep 2, 2009)

I'm glad you ignored my other points.

And again, you're implying the safety to what you view as being safe. We can only speak for ourselves, and so I suggested what *I* did. What *I* did. Why does this continue to get argued over. It's not a thesis. . .

People will restrain whatever it is they want to restrain, and on their level of what they themselves deem safe. Not by other standards pressed upon them, unless by law. Some may take advice, others won't. This is the ethics and logics code of the human mind. Yet, what I've said time and time again, that this suggestion was on my level of safety, not anyone else's, and it's still being disputed.

You said what you find safe, on *your* comfort of safety. And I merely voiced mine. People will take it for what it is. I do *not* understand the responses of "I'm right, you're wrong."

People's opinions should be recognized for what they're worth.

.......

Read any good books lately? <<;


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

aesthetics, your method of transporting was safe only because you did not get in an accident. If you had, there might have been a different outcome. Please quit arguing against using what has long been recommended and is the safest option. Yes it is ultimately up to the individual what they choose to use and people get your point so drop it. Understand?


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## smhufflepuff (Aug 28, 2008)

Nancy said:


> In the event of a power outage, the carrier can become a temporary cage giving a smaller area to try and keep warm.


In addition to the travel-related safety issues every one has mentioned, this is an excellent point.

And really relevant to me... it happened just last week. It wasn't a power outage per se, but had the same effect. One of Satin's CHE's blew and took out the thermostat control with it. I tried keeping her whole cage warm with a heating pad, SnuggleSafe, blankets, and handwarmers, but quickly realized it was not going to work. So out came her travel carrier outfitted with blankies and Bonzo the SnuggleSafe dog. He's a tad large for her carrier, but worked out decently; she was set for a few hours until I could come up with an alternate heating plan.


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## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

thank you Nancy and smhufflepuff


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## aesthetics (Sep 2, 2009)

Nancy said:


> was safe only because you did not get in an accident. If you had, there might have been a different outcome. Please quit arguing against using what has long been recommended and is the safest option. Yes it is ultimately up to the individual what they choose to use and people get your point so drop it. Understand?


It's called a deep discussion. And, I've been trying to drop it. Continually, actually.

Just beause accidents happen, doesn't suddenly make it anymore safe or unsafe. If that were the case, six million people each year would stop driving, no one would go on a plane, and people would avoid contact. It's called taking risks, and using the method of transportation I used wasn't a risk. Anything can happen. No one can predict that. So using a carrier that could inevitably get lost, dislogged, is just as risky as using a container.

I don't understand the need to attack people, because you (not, you you) don't agree with realistic methods. This is completely like smoking, or not smoking. Drinking, or not drinking. Being under the influence and driving, or not to do it. People make these decisions on their own. As people, we should at least educate them on *ALL* methods used. It's everyones right to know.

It's not that farfetched of a point. And now, I'm done.


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## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

i agree with Nancy...its only safe till you're in an accident...and using smoking and drinking as a comparison is absurd... a person choses to smoke or drink...a hedgehog can't chose to be transported in a box. The hedgie depends on its owner to do everything possible to keep them safe.


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

I am closing this because obviously my saying to quit arguing is difficult to understand.


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