# Biting



## Kuzukuzu27 (Oct 20, 2010)

My problem is rather obvious. Yoshi has started biting(a month ago or so).

Before, he'd nipped me a couple times, but it was likely because my hand smelled yummy.

However, now it's turned into something much worse. He bites me whenever he gets the chance. I know it's not yummy smells on my skin or anything. Thankfully, he hasn't latched onto my skin yet. My clothes, and blankets, ALL the time, but not my skin. He's only broken skin once.

I've had Yoshi since August, and this has only been the past month, as I said. I really don't understand why he's being this way. He used to be a pretty friendly guy, and now I'm worried to put my fingers anwhere near him.

He even goes out of his way to bite me. I picked him up today, and he tucked his chin down to bite my finger.

I've read the threads on biting here, but nothing I try seems to help. This biting issue, along with Yoshi being really grumpy lately, has really got me down and I'm hoping to find some help.

Thanks so much, guys. Everyone here has helped me with a ton of questions I've had, and I really appreciate all of you.


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## Puffers315 (Apr 19, 2010)

How old is he? Its possibly he's quilling which can turn some hedgehogs into really big grumps during the process. If he is, you'll find dropped quills in his cage and if you look closely, should be able to see quills coming up through his back. Some can quill really quick, others I think it can take awhile, but I'm not an expert.


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## Kuzukuzu27 (Oct 20, 2010)

No, he's not quilling. There haven't been any loose quills in his cage since August, when he was quilling.  Thank you for your input, though.


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## shaelikestaquitos (Feb 2, 2010)

Kashi went through a phase like that (lasted a couple of weeks) but now he's back to his usual self. I have no idea why he was like that, but shortly after he went through his second quilling (it came late) so I think maybe that's what's happening to your Yoshi.
Just keep handling him and hopefully he'll come around


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## Kuzukuzu27 (Oct 20, 2010)

So Yoshi's little habit has changed slightly. Now, as soon as he gets angry about anything, he chomps down on whatever's closest to him. Thankfully, it's usually a blanket, and not my skin. But if my fingers are anywhere near his face, he'll bite them. He also won't let me pick him up anymore without first curling into a vicious ball of spikes.

If anybody else has any advice, I would be very happy! Thanks again everyone.


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## Kuzukuzu27 (Oct 20, 2010)

Oh! One more thing.

I'm wondering whether it's good or bad to use some things that are used with horses, on Yoshi. For all you horse-owners/riders/trainers, you'll know what I'm talking about.

If I'm about to put Yoshi back in his cage, and he does something I don't like (such as biting, which he does CONSTANTLY -_-), I'll make him stop, and then wait until he's chilled out, and then let him into his home. Sorta like with horses, where you NEVER end on a bad note.

I know they're two COMPLETELY different animals, but it should technically work the same way, right? Make them realize that if they're good, they get what they want?


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## jinglesharks (Jun 15, 2010)

Kuzukuzu27 said:


> Oh! One more thing.
> 
> I'm wondering whether it's good or bad to use some things that are used with horses, on Yoshi. For all you horse-owners/riders/trainers, you'll know what I'm talking about.
> 
> ...


Yep, I've heard a few very knowledgeable people around here say you shouldn't put them down when they start biting or they'll associate bad behavior with possibly getting what they want. I mean, a horse is definitely more trainable than a hedgie, but you might still have some luck


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## MissC (Nov 15, 2010)

Kuzukuzu27 is absolutely right...

You explained it very well: you don't ever want to unwittingly reward undesired behavior or - it's a scientific fact - it will increase. (I used to LOVE behavior mod classes in psych) Likewise, when you WANT the behavior to increase, reward it (hence the large mealie consumption around here). 

Typically, what helps decrease undesired behavior is ignoring it. Now, that's kinda tough with biting but if you stop moving, wait until Yoshi calms, pet for a few minutes THEN move her or whatever. I won't even put Snarf down when he's squirming. I wait until he's calm and not huffing before moving him. Sometimes this means standing stooped over his cage for a loooong time. Little rotter.

So...ideally reward desired behavior like crazy (or even steps toward the desired behavior - when sitting calmly with you) and ignore all undesired behavior. You can slowly decrease the rewards. BF Skinner taught pigeons to play tennis this way. 'Course that's all he did all day. And they likely didn't have sharp teeth and quills. 

I better stop yapping. I could go on about this for hours. Maybe I'll go wake Jamie up and see if he wants to talk about psychology.


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## Kuzukuzu27 (Oct 20, 2010)

So whenever Yoshi bites me, I have the normal reflex of pulling away. However, this morning, after he bit me once, I decided I wasn't letting him learn that I'll pull away every time. So I put my finger in front of his face so he'd bite me again, and purposely stayed still. OUCH. He chomped on it, and gnawed on it and chewed it all up. There was/is no blood, however my finger is now hot and throbbing.  And quite the mess of teeth marks.

Was it a stupid idea to let him bite me like that? xD I mean, intentionally getting hurt was of course stupid, but I want to try to make Yoshi realize that biting won't make me go away. xP


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## MissC (Nov 15, 2010)

Kuzukuzu27 said:


> So whenever Yoshi bites me, I have the normal reflex of pulling away. However, this morning, after he bit me once, I decided I wasn't letting him learn that I'll pull away every time. So I put my finger in front of his face so he'd bite me again, and purposely stayed still. OUCH. He chomped on it, and gnawed on it and chewed it all up. There was/is no blood, however my finger is now hot and throbbing.  And quite the mess of teeth marks.
> 
> Was it a stupid idea to let him bite me like that? xD I mean, intentionally getting hurt was of course stupid, but I want to try to make Yoshi realize that biting won't make me go away. xP


NO! Not stupid at all!!! I think you taught him that he won't get a reaction if he bites you. Assuming it was a reaction he was looking for, back in his cage? food? wahtever...I think he'll learn pretty quickly - sorry but you might have to get gnawed on a few times as unwanted beh often increases before it decreases. It's what I plan to do if Snarf ever bites me. He seemed to try to chomp on me yesterday - not sure why? - my BF was watching and said 'you're just going to leave your finger in his face?' I said 'Yup. That's the plan.'

For what it's worth, *I* think you're doing the right thing. I am assuming - again - that he's healthy, well-nourished, not esp angry about anything etc etc etc. It seems, from reading the posts about beh issues, that they often go through stages...testing their limits, maybe?


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## Kuzukuzu27 (Oct 20, 2010)

From all that I've read, it sounds like he's gotten aggressive... The only reason I could see would be hormonal, because as you assume, I take good care of him. He's on good food, that hasn't been changed in months, he's got a flying saucer wheel that he uses for several hours a night. I use liners that I change every three days or so, or more often if they get too dirty. I give him a foot bath once or twice a week(he's a messy runner) and a full bath every two or three weeks when he's stinky. I take him out for at least an hour every night around 8 or 9(at least half an hour after his light's turned out). I have a CHE that keeps his cage at about 24C. I'd been using a little wooden hidey home, but recently switched to a hedgie bag that I made and he LOVES. He's always got fresh water.

I'm getting really frustrated. I'll put up with whatever he throws at me, but I really wish this would improve.

I've heard that with hormonal problems, neutering can fix the problem, but I don't have the money for that, and I've heard it's very dangerous. I'd rather not put Yoshi through something he doesn't require. Has anybody had similar problems? What has helped? Yoshi is getting more and more aggressive and I really appreciate the help of everyone here.

For what seems like the hundredth time, thank you. My pinky finger is not happy at all(and looks REALLY gross), but hopefully all my "effort" will pay off.


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## Kuzukuzu27 (Oct 20, 2010)

I am quite happy with the progress made today!

Wearing a pair of old leather gloves, I tempted Yoshi to bite. He did, and chomped a few times. But after a while, he got bored. I tempted him some more, and after one little nip, he was done. Later, I worked on handling him without the gloves(as sad as it may be, I've been quite nervous about that lately). Just before putting him back in his cage, he chomped down on his hedgiebag. So I waited until he let go, and handled him for a few more minutes. I managed to hold him in one bare hand with him in a loose ball and even rubbed his tummy with my thumb!!!

I'm really hoping that tonight wasn't just a fluke. xD I'm also hoping that this will only be the beginning of Yoshi's improvement.


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## MissC (Nov 15, 2010)

Good job, kuzu! I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you two.


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