# lump, scab, messed up toe, mites???



## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

hey guys 
so i got my 7 week old hedgie last weekend 
took him to the vet tuesday they said he was fine

but last night and this evening he has been constantly scratching, so i was curious to see if he had mites? 

so i picked him up to examine him and on his back foot there is a lump (maybe the size of 1/2 of a pea or so) and its red. this was obviously a big red flag to me. i looked underneath that foot and it seems there's a scab on his little pawpad area as well. 

also his inner toe on the same foot is messed up. the toe is overlapping slightly on top of the next one, and doesnt seem to go back into place when i tried moving it. 

i called two of the nearest vets (both a fair distance away) and both were closed. i was hoping to get some possible insight here? 

i purchased my hedgehog from janda exotics, and after doing a search of them on this forum, now realize that maybe i shouldn't have? 

regardless, i hope he's okay! im anxious waiting to contact a vet


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## writergirlmel (May 16, 2015)

It's hard to say without photos, but it sounds like an injury.

How is he acting? Hedgies are really good at hiding discomfort, so even if he's acting normally, it probably warrants a visit to the vet, but if he's not bleeding, there's no discoloration in the leg outside of the lump, he can walk normally, and he's eating & drinking normally, it _might_ be able to wait until Monday. But I'd start getting an emergency vet in mind just in case.


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

i attempted taking a photo, but he was too wiggly and squirmy 

he has been acting perfectly fine, walking, eating, and drinking all regularly as well as digging around in his bedding (which i just switched him to fleece today) 

i'll try calling tomorrow, and if no luck, monday


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

also, would it be safe to bathe him or trim his nails?


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

i checked on him again after i heard him scratching some more, (for the past few hours constantly) and now he is pooping green and runny. 

can this wait until monday or is this more serious?


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## liam1 (Feb 15, 2015)

I honestly think it is something more serious especially if his poop is green and running. If you can get him into the vet before Monday, please do so. If not all you can really do is keep an eye out on him. The lump may get infected if he starts biting it, and the alleged mites are causing him some discomfort.


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

alright  is there anything i can do in the meantime to ease him? and should i still be handling him?


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## writergirlmel (May 16, 2015)

I'm not sure about handling him, but no, I don't think it can wait until Monday. There really shouldn't be a "meantime." It's time to take him to the emergency vet.


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

currently en route to the nearest emergency vet that's available today (an hour away D: ) 
more constant scratching, and he's been pooping small bits at a time. one even had something strange and white in it.


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## writergirlmel (May 16, 2015)

kipper said:


> currently en route to the nearest emergency vet that's available today (an hour away D: )
> more constant scratching, and he's been pooping small bits at a time. one even had something strange and white in it.


Keep us posted!


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

sitting in the lobby waiting for the vet to wrap things up, but he is okay! 
vet gave him gas to give him a better inspection 
the lump on his foot/crooked toe is the result of a broken toe healing crookedly, and a callous forming on his bone. she said it isn't causing him any discomfort and nothing needs to be done ! 
as for his itching, she said there might be possible mites, so I should switch him onto carefresh for a few weeks
his poop is going to be tested for parasites and stuff, but he should have his diet switched (old food from breeder has dehydrated fruit in it, which could have caused it) 

SOO he's alright! I'm just a little disappointed the breeder didn't mention the broken toe, or that during his wellness exam they didn't give a very thorough exam. the vet here at the emergency clinic knew what she was doing which I'm thankful for


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

If they think the itching might be mites, it's best to go ahead and treat him with Revolution. You don't want to switch him to Carefresh, the mites can still live in it like with wood bedding. It'd be best to switch to liners, at least temporarily, until you can be sure he doesn't have mites. Liners can be as simple as a length of fleece cut to fit the cage or cut twice as long & folded over for two layers. If you go ahead & treat him with the Revolution, keep in mind that he should be treated 2-3 times, 2-3 weeks apart.

What food was the breeder giving him? Sounds like a diet change is definitely a good idea.  Let us know if you need help with it, but there are a lot of stickies discussing foods in the Nutrition forum.

Glad to hear things seem okay though! Good for you for getting him into the vet right away to make sure he's okay.


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

yeah the vet recommended getting him revolution in the next week or so which I'll be scheduling an appointment for that soon. 

as for the food from the breeder--it's a mix called pokey crunch. the ingredients say it contains high protein kibble, insectivore diet, dehydrated fruit, mealworms, bee pollen, and calcium. 

the vet suggested I purchase Mazuri hedgehog food. 

I'll probably keep him with fleece for now since we bought about 2 1/2 yards yesterday. 

thank you tons for the feedback!


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

Yeah, dried fruit & bugs aren't good, so while the food might not be awful, it's not perfect with those things added. Personally I don't like not knowing all of the ingredients of a food anyway, and I don't see anything showing which kibble is used on their site.

However, I'd also recommend ignoring the vet's suggestion. Most hedgehog foods are crap, and Mazuri is no different. Most vets are unfortunately not great at nutrition past the basics unless they make a point to specialize in it and do more research. So unfortunately a lot of them seem to recommend crappy hedgehog foods because well, it's a hedgehog. :roll: The Nutrition forum stickies will help you more with what to get and what to look for.


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## writergirlmel (May 16, 2015)

Can someone with more experience tell us if it's possible that a broken toe could begin to heal crookedly _and_ form a callous on the bone within a week? Because if it's not, I'd recommend contacting Janda Exotics and asking them to cover the cost of the vet visit since that would mean the injury occurred before you brought him home.

This particular situation isn't mentioned in their health guarantee as it's not a parasite or infection found within 72 hours nor a fatal or life altering condition. But it does say that their animals are guaranteed to arrive healthy, and if the injury had to have occurred before he was in your hands, he obviously didn't. Then again, they also specifically state they'll only cover medications for illness found in the initial (within 72 hour exam) or replacement (in the case of death due to a congenital condition), and the issue wasn't noted in his 72-hour well exam, so I'm guessing they'll say no. But it doesn't hurt to ask.

In any case, I'm the little guy is going to be okay!


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

I texted the breeder, and if there's no reply in the next day or so, I will email her as well as call her if no reply to my email. I'm pretty sure this fracture happened before I got him and she failed to mention it (I noticed the crooked toe on wednesday but I failed to notice the lump) which obviously meant that I was in the dark on his foot and spent $247 to pay for his exam, sevoflurane, and fecal float and it could have all been avoided! not to mention I'm having to pay for revolution soon after the breeder told me he was given parasite treatment on 7/10. oh well 

as for food, they didn't carry the hedgehog food anyways and recommended me ferret food (no way!!) so I picked up Blue Basics turkey and potato recipe, and it says 28% protein, 12% fat, and 7% fiber 
I'm hoping this will be okay for him and I plan on finding something to supplement his fiber with something as I switch him from his old food to his new. 
is this food okay for him? and what can I use as a supplement? 

(other than that the vet said he was extremely healthy  )


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## writergirlmel (May 16, 2015)

The numbers look good on the food. I'm not able to check the ingredients at the moment, but most of the Blue Buffalo foods seem to be good on that front. 

The fiber content in that one is quite good, so you may not need to supplement much. A lot of people sprinkle baby cereal on the food or use insects. Crickets are good choice for fiber, I believe. 

I'd also consider adding in at least one more high quality kibble of a different brand and protein source and offering it as a mix (once he has adjusted to his new food). That way, you cover more nutritional bases and are protected against food strikes if your food suddenly changes formulas, gets recalled, or becomes otherwise unavailable.


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

alright thank you so much guys! 
as for his food, do i make switches seperately? 
i.e. change him from his food now to the new one i got today, and then after hes done with that and 100% on the new one, start mixing it with another brand? 
as for the mix, do i make it 50/50?


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## twobytwopets (Feb 2, 2014)

Sorry I have t figured out how to do multiple quotes on a thread so I will copy and paste your questions....



as for his food, do i make switches seperately? 
i.e. change him from his food now to the new one i got today, and then after hes done with that and 100% on the new one, start mixing it with another brand? 

Yes. If you are doing one food switched out for a mix but aren't using the old food in the new mix you go through the changing over with one food at a time. Once your hedgehog is switched from old food to new food and you are sure there is no issues then you start to do the switch from one new food to the mix.

as for the mix, do i make it 50/50? 

You can. Most would say while the mix is only 2 foods it would be best if it was a 50/50 mix.


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

awesome, just fed him and put 25% of the new food in, mixed it up and he ate it. so i think all is well now with everything! 

thank you for the advice you guys, it helped me tons ^_^


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## writergirlmel (May 16, 2015)

kipper said:


> awesome, just fed him and put 25% of the new food in, mixed it up and he ate it. so i think all is well now with everything!
> 
> thank you for the advice you guys, it helped me tons ^_^


Make sure you pause for a few days before increasing the amount of new food in a mix. My vet and breeder both like about a week between phases, but since there are some very undesirable components in the old food, you might get away with a just a few days as long as he tolerates it well.

There's really two ways of switching foods. Most people do go ahead and switch to the first food in the mix 100%. Then, they start adding the rest of the foods in the mix, one by one, until the mix is how they want it.

You can also simply add in the new foods, one at a time, while decreasing the old food. For example, if you're going to end up with a mix of 4 kibbles (which is really a lot unless you have multiple hedgies or a cat to eat a good chunk of it, but it's great for explanation), you'd do it like this:

Week 1: 75% old food, 25% new food 1
Week 2: 50% old food, 25% new food 1, 25% new food 2
Week 3: 25% old food, 25% new food 1, 25% new food 2, 25% new food 3
Week 4: 25% new food 1, 25% new food 2, 25% new food 3, 25% new food 4

Personally, I prefer that method because it cuts a few weeks off the transition while still introducing new foods one at a time.


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

I made another topic more specific to his food, but

for the second method, does that mean I need 4 diff types of food? I'm a little confused on how that was explained, my fault for not comprehending  

I was thinking of just using two brands of food, as it'd be easier to measure out and mix ( I feed 2 tbsp every evening) 

also is it ok to give him mealies? I bought 100ct live mealworms. I want to gut load them and give them to him as a treat


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## PEBBLES83 (Jul 19, 2015)

Hope he's okay


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## writergirlmel (May 16, 2015)

kipper said:


> I made another topic more specific to his food, but
> 
> for the second method, does that mean I need 4 diff types of food? I'm a little confused on how that was explained, my fault for not comprehending
> 
> ...


Oh, no, you don't have to have 4 types of food. I just explained it that way because it was easily divisible. If you're going to ultimately have, say, 2 in the mix, and neither of them are foods you're offering now, it'd work like this.

Phase 1: 75% old food, 25% new food 1
Phase 2: 50% old food, 50% new food 1
Phase 3: 25% old food, 50% new food 1, 25% new food 2
Phase 4: 50% new food 1, 50% new food 2

The slower/more traditional method would be:
Phase 1: 75% old food, 25% new food 1
Phase 2: 50% old food, 50% new food 1
Phase 3: 25% old food, 75% new food 1
Phase 4: 100% new food 1
Phase 5: 75% new food 1, 25% new food 2
Phase 6: 50% new food 1, 50% new food 2

So, with only two foods in a mix, it just cuts the transition time by 2 weeks. If you're using more foods, the difference is greater.

Either way will work. It's just a matter of preference and how anxious you are to get the main diet stabilized so that you can start adding treats and such.

And it's absolutely okay to give mealies. Just let them warm up and eat something like carrot for a couple of days at first and then for a day every week or two just for maintenance. Otherwise, keep them in the fridge. We purchased a cute little container to keep ours in just so any guests don't peek in the fridge and get a little weirded out by a container labeled "live mealworms."


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

OH okay that makes sense now haha sorry!! 
I'll definitely try the first phase suggestion. I'll try and speed it up so I can get him off of his 1st food, but then ease it back a little when mixing the two new ones on the last couple of phases. I have about a two week time frame to go ahead and settle him into his new food before I leave for vacation 

thanks for the help


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

also for the mealworms, how long do they last in the fridge? I have them in there now and I don't want to mess with them till his diets switched over and I'm back home so I can gut load him and stuff (I think mid August)


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## writergirlmel (May 16, 2015)

kipper said:


> also for the mealworms, how long do they last in the fridge? I have them in there now and I don't want to mess with them till his diets switched over and I'm back home so I can gut load him and stuff (I think mid August)


We're still on our first batch, but I've been told they'll last up to a couple of months in the fridge.


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## twobytwopets (Feb 2, 2014)

But you have to take them out once a week to warm up and eat.


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## alia (Jul 17, 2015)

ok so, I take them out once a week, wait till they're room temp, and give a few to Bernie? then do I put them back in? and do I only have to gut load them once?


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## writergirlmel (May 16, 2015)

twobytwopets said:


> But you have to take them out once a week to warm up and eat.


Oops. I thought I mentioned that earlier. Thanks for catching it!


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