# HELP hedgie getting obese



## Nick120180 (Oct 27, 2014)

Ive switched my hogs to a raw diet and the two females have been fine but my males just keeps getting bigger and bigger. This morning was the first time I've seen where he genuinely can't fully ball and his legs are getting ham hock ish. 
He was 550 when I switched to raw and is 630g now. The puzzle is he only gets fed 25g of insect / meat and the rest is veg. He just keeps gaining though! Gonna drop to 22g and completely remove mealworms even as treats.

Anyone have this specific issue on raw diet and am I going to have to switch him back to biscuits? He's always been prone to weight gain even on biscuit. 

He's also really lazy, uses his wheel but only for 10-20 seconds at a time and also sleeps most of the night. Probably only active 3-4hrs a day. Temps 77f and unchanging. Turning it up just makes him splat, and down didn't make any difference.

So frustrated as I love him to bits and have done so much to give him a perfect life but just can't stop this and feel terrible!

P.s. I wonder if the 5:2 diet may work for him. Maybe 2 nights a week just give him a big plate of veg and maybe just 3g meat. This may mimick the more varied foraging they'd have in the wild and give a chance for his metabolism to burn through some of the stored fat. Thoughts?


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## Soyala_Amaya (Aug 1, 2011)

25 grams of food seems like a lot. When syringe feeding a sick hedgehog, you try to get 24 ml of food into them in a 24 hour period. I'm not sure how much 24 ml of wet food weighs, but it seems like you may just be over feeding him. I think, with bowl, my boys raw diet (wet blender mix for hydration) weighs about 20 grams, and that's two tablespoons of food. 

Qwerty has been ill and also not running like he used to, and even at those amounts he has put on about 60 grams. So he now swims for three-four minutes every night before we cuddle on the couch. I don't want him to get healthy with his food and then get sick because of it!

Some hedgehogs will self regulate and only eat till they're full, but just like people, if something is delicious, and they have constant access, some hedgies are prone to overeating. 

I will weigh Qwerty's food tonight and get back to you, just to make sure I'm remembering his measurements correctly.


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## Nick120180 (Oct 27, 2014)

Glad you've seen a similar issue. Well glad as in its not just me. I've tried making mine swim and he's so terrified I don't really want to put him through it.

By the way 24ml of water is 24g I'm pretty sure, so food would be about the same. I also reversed calculated it and made the calorie intake similar to 12g biscuit.

Really unsure where to go, I'm sat in the lounge at 2am and he's running his little heart out, but I know as soon as he's in the cage it'll be straight to bed. Do you think it's the increased saturated fat content of the meat?

I'll play with his wheel see if I can make it more appealing for him. Maybe try and find a more sturdy bucket for the larger hog!

Kinda like my 5:2 diet idea, will try it and see how he responds.

Worst comes to worst I'll be the first person to market a treadmill for hedgehogs saying that the lazy little turd would probably just roll up and spin😆


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## Soyala_Amaya (Aug 1, 2011)

Have you spoken to a pet nutritionist? I had one look over my recipe I posted in "Our Raw Adventure" to double check my numbers. I'm not sure exactly what you're feeding in what ratios so it's hard to comment. I'm also going to send off a sample of mine to a zoo food analysis lab that does outside samples for a small feel. It's only 20-30 dollars, and then I'll have a bunch more answers on fats and fibers on what I'm feeding! 

As for the swimming, yeah, he's stressed, he doesn't like it. However, just like our cuddles and love time, sometimes he just has to accept things he doesn't like because I know it's good for him. He does it for a few minutes every night and since we started we've been maintaining instead of gaining. I want him to lose as well, eventually, but I'll work on that when I get a clean bill of healthy from the vet.


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## Nick120180 (Oct 27, 2014)

The meat is a pre mixed ground frozen cat food in 3 flavours. Chicken/rabbit, chicken/salmon, chicken/duck. Average ratios are 18% protein, 5% fats and oils, 4% crude, 70 odd percent water.

In dry mass I've concluded that's pretty high fat, so may well be the issue.

Think I'm going to blend it all with some frozen locust, crickets and Turkey mince. Weigh it out and try and get the fat below 15% as a dry mass ratio. Also add a bit more fibre.

I've also just ordered a load of Phoenix worms which are meant to be an excellent feeder. Hopefully he'll like them.

I've tried a couple of local vets for advice but neither felt they new enough to be of help.

I'll google a nutritionist.


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## Soyala_Amaya (Aug 1, 2011)

Wow, yeah, 15% fat is pretty high, especially if your hog is lazier already. 10-12% is the recommended range for average hogs, and if he's prone to weight gain, 8-10% is better. 

Are you sure you have your numbers typed right though? Because 18% protein is also WAY too low. It should be between 30-35%!


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## paula109 (Apr 6, 2015)

My hedgehog his stomach pain, since the food I was change. give me advice, diet safe food for my little hedgehog.


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## Nick120180 (Oct 27, 2014)

Bit of an update on how my porky little fella is doing:

He's now on 6-8g low fat insects per day, locust, cricket, Dubai roaches and calci worms, 15g of BARF meat which has been cut with low fat Turkey mince to reduce fat, and 15g of mixed veg (he's really good and eats the veg without bribery).

I've rebuilt his wheel using 22mm water pipe. This give a far more rigid stable wheel and hopefully has increased running.

So far he's down 13g, the yellowish fat deposits around his legs are gone and he feels harder all round so looks like progress is being made.

Overall loving the raw diet; no smell, no poop wheels, less poop overall and very happy hogs! Also their wees that used to be very dark and smelly are now clear and far bigger, so they appear far better hydrated.


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

That's great, I'm glad to hear you've made some progress with his weight! Sounds like your hedgies are doing fantastic with their new diet.


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## Nick120180 (Oct 27, 2014)

Can't believe that the diets preventing poopy wheels! So happy:grin:


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