# WHS or rabies?! Please Help!



## ariellesarai (Nov 28, 2011)

Hi please somebody help me. My female hedgehog has been acting very weird lately. She has been coming out during the day a lot. She comes out and drinks a lot of water. It feels like she is loosing weight I have not seen her eating lately. I have noticed her drooling and one time I saw her attempting eating one of her kibbles and it looked like her jaw got "stuck" or something also when drinking water she looked like she had a smile on her mouth as if she was having trouble opening her mouth and could not get her jaw to move. She has also been very anxious and grumpy, and a couple of times she seemed like she was having trouble with her back legs as if she felt they were "cramping" cause she was shaking them. Also she looked like she was biting at the air or it coukd have been she was having trouble with her jaw? I took her to vet today and the vet said she was sure it wasn't rabies. But I cant help to feel nervous my 7 year old, me and my boyfriend kiss her alll the time. The vet did x-rays on her jaw. She was afraid she might have some king of jaw injury. When she was sedated the vet came into the room and showed me how my hedgies lower jaw moves side to side is this normal? Finally she said that it looks like she has got WHS  Has anyones hedgie had this symptoms before is this really WHS? She gave me a bunch of medications and supplements like Clavamox, ox bow carnivore care, diluted metacam, and avix booster, and told me to change her diet and to sprinkle calcium powder in her mealworms. Is this really WHS or could it be something else or can it be RABIES? PLease help. I am so stressed and sad because I hand raised this little baby since she was 1 week old when her mommy got sick. She is my little girl. And I do not know what is wrong with her or if my family and I are in any danger :?


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## AngelaH (Jul 24, 2012)

I feel certain that it wouldn't be rabies, it is transmitted through saliva from another rabies infected animal. So, unless she was outside and got bit by another animal, it wouldn't be rabies. 

It could be WHS. I personally haven't had experience with that, but some of our members on here have, so hopefully they will see this and offer advice. While you wait for that I would read up what you can about WHS.

Sending you and your hedgie positive thoughts and vibes.


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## chouck (Oct 5, 2012)

Where would she have gotten rabies? Was she bitten by another animal?


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

As the others and your vet said, it's almost definitely rabies - she'd have to be bit by an animal carrying rabies. 

A couple of questions for you - 

How old is your hedgehog?
What diet are you currently feeding her? Did the vet say what she wants you to change it to?
What temperature is her cage?
Does she have a light schedule of 12-14 hours of light daily?

Did the vet say what kind of jaw injury she thinks she has, and/or how she got it? What makes her think it's WHS? I'm hesitant to think it's WHS even though I've not had experience with it - WHS starts slow and takes time to progress. If your little girl has jaw problems and hasn't 'been eating well, my first guess is that her erratic behavior and trouble walking comes from weakness from not getting enough food. Diet issues can cause problems like that as well.


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## nikki (Aug 28, 2008)

If she had rabies she would be hydrophobic, meaning she would be scared of water and not drinking it all. There is no way she has rabies. 

I agree with Lilysmommy that it doesn't seem like WHS. WHS comes on slowly over time and doesn't affect appetite till it has progressed a lot. If she's having trouble eating her kibble, try softening it with water and see if that helps. If she's not eating at all she needs to be syringe fed.


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## ariellesarai (Nov 28, 2011)

Thank you all for answering so soon to my questions. First she has never been outside and no animal has bitten her. I do have other hedgies 3 ( Prissy 4, Mishka 3 and Smurfette 2) I do not own any other pets except for birds, parakeets and finches. She has not been in contact with any other wild or domesticated animals. It is just that I got paranoid with so much stuff that there is on internet. There was an article that said that a rabid bat could come inside your home without you knowing. And all of her symptoms are so weird. My other hedgies do not act that way. Xena that is her name is almost 1 year old. I feed her Purina Cat Chow plus vitamins and minerals. And I give her meal worms 2-3x a week as treat. She does not like other fruits or veggies I have tried encouraging her but nothing works. She just munches on other food and anoints herself and does not pay attention to it afterwards. When she was a baby I hand feed her Esbilac for puppies goats milk up until she turned 7 months old. It was very difficult for her the change from goats milk to solids (cat chow) I do not know if this is the best cat chow but when I got my first hedgie the breeder that I got it from gave me a sample of this Purina cat chow and that is what I have been feeding them ever since. The doctor recommended to change to commercial hedgehog food diet Mazuri. My house temp is 73 -74 when it is cold and warm it stays that way. I have never had any problems with any of my hedgies with hibernation. She has been getting less sun lately but so have my other hedgies and they are still acting normal and not getting up during the day. I just do not know what is wrong with her :? I am so worried


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## shmurciakova (Sep 7, 2008)

You know, if it were me I would take her back to the vet. #1, what type of jaw injury does she think your Xena has? It is not normal for the jaw to go from side to side, how did this begin? I would not worry about her eating Purina at this point, but I would try to either wet it down with water, or give her a high quality wet cat food, or semi-soft food so that she might be able to eat more.....you can worry about switching her food later.
I have two hunches regarding this situation. I think that there could be something wrong with her kidneys (thus the excessive drinking), OR the other thing that it sounds to me like is that she could have had a stroke. These are both based on my medical training in humans. I don't know if these hunches are right or not. Also, like the others said, WHS does not just suddenly happen - and that is not what the symptoms you described sound like to me anyway. Although, it is a neurological disease and could possibly account for the stroke-like symptoms...it is just odd though because WHS usually manifests with the hedgehog falling over, etc. 
I hope you can get some better answers or else maybe consider taking her to another different vet.
I am sorry your little one is having such a hard time!
Good luck,
Susan H.


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## Lilysmommy (Jan 7, 2009)

I would agree change the food...but I disagree with your vet on the hedgehog food. Most hedgehog foods have no better ingredients than Purina Cat Chow - which has pretty terrible ingredients. A good quality cat food should not have any corn in the ingredients, and should have a meat or meat meal as the first ingredient. You don't want any food dyes, either, or BHA, BHT, or ethoxyquin (which can all cause things like cancer). It would really be good for your hedgehogs to switch to a better quality food. Some of the brands that are popular on the forum include Solid Gold, Natural Balance, Chicken Soup for the Cat Lover's Soul, Innova, and Blue Buffalo. They're a bit more expensive, but they're much healthier for your hedgehogs, and since hedgehogs don't eat a huge amount, a bag will last you for quite awhile, even with three hedgehogs.

I would recommend keeping a light on in the room where your hedgehogs are for 12-14 hours during the day. They do need a good light schedule, since less light can tell them that it's winter and time to hibernate. They may not have had issues yet, but that doesn't guarantee that they never will.

Since your girl is sick, I would also suggest trying to keep her temperature a bit higher - perhaps 75-77. It will help give her body less to worry about as it deals with the other issues. If her belly has stayed nice and warm and she's not attempting hibernation, the trouble walking & odd behavior are likely from her jaw issues and not eating as well.

Did the vet say anything about the jaw injury? What caused it, what it is (broken, dislocated, etc.) and whether it'll be resolved? If she's not eating on her own, like Nikki said, you need to be syringe-feeding her. The Carnivore Care is for syringe-feeding, and you'll want to try and get around 24 mL into her over the course of the day. If she only eats say, 4 mL in a sitting, feed her again four hours later. Try to keep food in her stomach - she needs that energy to keep up her strength. The medications might also upset her stomach, so even if she has been eating a bit, she might stop because her tummy doesn't feel good. So keep an eye on her food intake so you'll know whether you need to supplement her feeding. You can try and encourage her to eat on her own - leave a couple different options in the cage for her at night. Something like a dish of Carnivore Care, a dish of dampened kibble, a dish of crushed kibble, etc. 

Right now, focus on getting food into her. If you think she might be willing to sample a better quality cat food, go ahead and offer her some of that too. If she does a sudden switch from old food to new food (as some hedgehogs will on their own), that may also cause her poop to go green, but it won't hurt her in the long run. 

Also, to help with the green poops from meds, etc. you can get probiotics to add to the food - either small animal BeneBac (found in pet stores) or acidophilus (for humans, found in the pharmacy section near vitamins). Make sure you add it to the food a couple hours before/after you give antibiotics - the antibiotics will just kill the good bacteria in the probiotics, so they'd be useless then.

Lots of info all at once! Ask if you're confused on anything, or have more questions on how to help her! And some more information on what the vet said about her jaw might help give us some more ideas on how to better care for her or what to ask the vet about.


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## FiaSpice (Jan 16, 2009)

ariellesarai said:


> ... I do not know if this is the best cat chow but when I got my first hedgie the breeder that I got it from gave me a sample of this Purina cat chow and that is what I have been feeding them ever since.


That's not the best food ou there. I would look for Blue Bufallo, Chicken soup and all the food recoomended in this thread viewtopic.php?f=6&t=15



shmurciakova said:


> ...OR the other thing that it sounds to me like is that she could have had a stroke.


It does sounds like this. Litchi had one and she suddenly acted like a severly WHS affected hedgie. She was acting weird on top of having huge trouble moving. As you can see on my signature, her coutcome wasn't positive.

If the vet can't give you a good answer, maybe change vet?


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## ariellesarai (Nov 28, 2011)

Thank you all for your advice I will change my babies diet. I am going to try and feed her if she lets me. And about changing the vet it is really hard as I have come to find out there aren't really a lot of exotic pet vets around my area  This is the second vet that I see, I already changed from vet clinic once. I will keep watching her and see how he is doing tomorrow and I will let you know tomorrow. Thank you all


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## Nancy (Aug 22, 2008)

It sounds to me like she has something wrong with her mouth. Her leg issues may just be because she is sick. 

You mentioned the vet said her lower jaw moves from side to side? How much does it move side to side? That isn't normal and sounds like perhaps her jaw is broken. If so, that is why she is having trouble eating. 

I would soften her kibble to see if that helps. You can also start syringe feeding her. With syringing we often get a very good look at mouth movements and can see anything abnormal. She does need a better food, but do it very slowly so as not to upset her stomach and cause more problems. 

This doesn't sound like WHS, but because she is having mobility issues and your vet thinks it might be, that line should not be bred until it is verified that she doesn't have it.


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## ariellesarai (Nov 28, 2011)

My little Xena has been eating and drinking ok. I have my house temp at 76 now. But she still looks like she is having trouble with her jaw. I will have to take her to the vet again Monday.


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## ariellesarai (Nov 28, 2011)

Thank you Nancy for your advice. When the vet showed me how Xenas jaw moved from side to side it looked like a lot of movement. She does seem to be having trouble munching her kibbles. She has been eating ok and drinking a lot of water. About her getting up during the day to drink water I guess it is because she feels sick? Or maybe because when I used to hand feed her I used to give her the food during the day and also at night. I do not know I never have paid a lot of attention of her eating schedule. I do like to watch them when they come out and eat just to check and see that they are doing ok. I do think that you and like others have said her problem has to do with the jaw. I was watching her just now and she tried to munch one of her kibbles and again that same problem it looks as if her jaw gets "stuck" or something and she looks she is smiling and she just can't move her mouth. That is when she starts to move backwards and I guess she gets so stressed because of her jaw and she just moves around backwards and when she does this she looks well weird. Poor of my baby the vet did take some x rays but she did not say anything about her jaw being fractured. Could her jaw just be dislocated? I do not understand why the vet did not see this. And if it is dislocated what can the vet and I do for her to be comfortable again? Is there any cure for this or will she have to live with her jaw dislocated? As for breeding I did used to enjoy having little hedgehog babies. I lost a daughter almost 3 years ago and I have not been able to become pregnant again. The little baby hedgehogs brought so much joy to my boyfriend and I but since last time when Xena was born she was born to a litter of 6 and she was the only one that made it. Their mommy Mishka became sick, she had some kind of tongue injury and could not feed them nor feed herself I had to syringe feed her. I started hand feeding the babies but unfortunately and because I did not had any experience only Xena made it. Since then I have not tried breeding them again. It break my heart to see the little ones suffer one by one that I decided never to breed them again just for my selfishness  . And so because I knew that I would be tempted to breed them again and have little hedgehog babies running around the house I decided to re home  my 2 male hedgehogs. I had my "Kalimba" an all white and dark mask hedgehog. And "Sonic" a snowflake male. Thank you all for all your advice and when I take her back to see the vet I will let you know what the vet said.


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